Becky Sampson on Faith after Fallout

Jethro Jones: Welcome to a decade.

Never to be forgotten.

I am just loving this project.

If you're new, the thing we do here
is we are talking to the same people,

uh, every year for the next 10 years.

There's a companion 10 year journal that
you can sign up for and join@adntbf.com.

Uh, or add a decade never
to be forgotten.com.

Click the journal button up on
the top and you can join that.

And the goal here is hearkening back
to Elder Stevenson's 2024 October

general conference talk where he
talked about the next 10 years being

a decade never to be forgotten.

And here's what I'm learning.

Uh, everybody has a life.

They go through trials and we
get to look back and we see this

perfect line of how God made things
happen, just how they needed to.

And it's amazing.

And what I'm trying to do with this
is share that line as it's happening.

There's going to be trials,
there's going to be frustration.

There's going to be sadness.

There's going to be disappointment
over the next 10 years with each of

the people that we're talking to and.

I wanna capture that in the moment so
that you can say, here's what's happening.

I'm frustrated.

It's not what I want.

But later we can see that
it's what God had in store.

So that's the whole purpose here.

Uh, thank you so much
for joining us today.

We have Becky Sampson.

Becky, welcome to a decade,
never to be Forgotten.

So excited to have you here.

Becky Sampson: I thank you so much
for considering me for this, this,

it, it really is an honor because
I am all for what you're doing and

being able, I'm a huge documenter.

Like I, and, and if we don't document,
we can't, I always say, um, don't

ever look back unless you're looking
back to see how far you've come.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Oh, I like that.

Becky Sampson: Yeah.

Because we go back to
shame ourselves, right.

And I'm like, no, no, no.

It all had a purpose.

It

Yeah.

fits together,

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Good.

Well, uh, when I met you, uh, last week
and we started talking, I, I just knew

that you would be a great person to
have on here because you've already had

so many amazing experiences, and I can
tell that you're someone who's going to

have amazing experiences going forward.

And despite your trials, you are still
strong in your testimony of Christ,

and that is the important thing.

Yeah.

And so, um.

The, so let's just start with this.

Uh, what brought you to where you are now?

And, you know, you can tell whatever
parts of the story you think are

important right now, and we've got
the next 10 years together so we

can, we can bring up something.

Becky Sampson: me.

Jethro Jones: Yeah, that's right.

So, 10 years we're committed to this.

Where do you wanna start?

What do you wanna start
talking about here?

Becky Sampson: Oh, you know, I, you
know, it's funny, I always ask that

question to people when I, because I've
done podcasting and interviewing and

radio, TV for the last 15 years, and
love that question because it, it really

you back to what caused me to be in
this very moment today, like in 2025.

Right?

So what created, um, you know, so
I grew up in a family, um, of five.

So my dad was from Richfield in,
in the Richfield, um, Utah area.

My mom was from Salt Lake, um, but
they ended up in California where

my dad was a professor and he taught
accounting, but his number one

love was to start a summer camp.

kids in southern Utah here.

I actually, I'm back in
the Richfield area now.

Funny story.

But, um, but he started the summer
camp for every summer of our lives.

We would come out to, um, a place
called Bik Mill, Utah, just outside

of, um, capital Reef National Park.

Well, I was the fourth child down
of five, and when I came out, my

mom said, man, I had one leg out.

And you were out the door like you were,
was, I was ready to, to conquer the world.

And, um, and that really was a
defining moment for our family

because I think I came out with
more energy than anybody else.

Um, and I, and many times they didn't
know how to handle that level of

energy and, um, gusto so to speak.

Jethro Jones: Ah,

Becky Sampson: So,

Jethro Jones: I like that.

Becky Sampson: I'm, I've
never used that word.

I guess it just came to me.

But, but Gusto and I was a
very, very outgoing, child.

I was very social.

My mom was always saying to me, she
goes, I don't know how you do it.

But within two minutes of talking to
any stranger out there, you know all

of their background, you know who
they are, you know, their family and

every, I just have been a talker and
a communicator from a very young age.

then there was about
seven or eight years old.

As I've done a lot of internal work in
my life, I can kind of see that was when

my turning point was in my life where I
felt like I had to kind of more restrain

myself because, of certain things that
happened in my life, and I know it sounds

kind of strange to some people that this
would be something that, affected me.

But I had an older brother, not my
oldest brother, but my second oldest

brother, and he was a basketball star.

The star of the family, like
everybody wanted to be in his life.

And at a young age, I think I looked
up to him and wanted to be like him.

I wanted to be liked by him.

I wanted to be accepted by hi like him.

And many times he would say to me,
he's like, Becky, why is the sky blue?

Go away.

We don't want you here.

And, I come from a really
good family, just so you know.

at a young age, I started internalizing
that, that I needed to be quiet.

I needed to, hold back.

I needed to not express myself.

And that I wasn't acceptable.

Another defining moment for me was I
also struggled with staying still, right?

And a lot of people talk about this now
because we, we talk so openly about it.

in school I was so afraid to look stupid
that when I took tests, I would bubble

in the, the little, you know how it used
to be like a, B, C, DE, F or whatever,

and you put your little pencil and
you go A, C, D, F, and I, instead of

reading and then comprehending what I was
reading, I would just bubble it all in.

and then they came to me one day and
said, I had a reading disability.

And I was like, oh, they
don't know anything.

Like, I'm not that dumb.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: And, and I had a hard
time reading out loud and I would, um,

fumble up words and things like that.

And next thing I know, in second
grade, they pulled me outta second

grade and took me into a private,
um, a special reading class.

And at first my mom said that
I did really well with that.

Like I, she goes, you really liked it.

But then all of a sudden, one day
in my own little mind as a seven

and 8-year-old, whatever I was, she,
she said, it was like overnight that

I decided, wait a minute, hold on.

They think I'm stupid.

And so I really internalized
that processes that I'm stupid.

And if I'm stupid not as a 7-year-old
doesn't think about all this.

But after all these years of,
you know, doing therapy and

everything, I realized as a little
child, I, I decided I was stupid.

I was going to now not apply myself.

And so then by not applying myself
in school and not doing my homework

and not being perfect at it, um, I
ended up getting D's and F's and I

barely graduated from high school
with a 1.7, which is a D average.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: Um, and I spent most
of my life feeling absolutely stupid.

But also what happened to me at that
point was, is that I, um, I ended

up turning to food and I started
hiding, stealing, eating binging.

That was kind of my,

uh.

My go-to because there wasn't
anything else I could do.

Um, so over the years growing up at the
summer camp, I couldn't understand why

I would start relationships and everyone
would like me at first, but I had a

really hard time holding relationships.

and after interviewing, which
is interesting 'cause I, I did

a podcast many years ago and
interviewed my BA best friend

Mm-hmm.

and she goes, Becky, I had
no idea that you struggled.

She goes, 'cause you were the most
outgoing, like loving, accepting person.

But internally, my self-esteem
took a massive hit.

And, um, it took me many years.

And then of course I gained
weight and then I felt even

less accepted by other people.

And then, um, in all kinds of things.

And then when, when high school came,
I, I at one point wanted to out and I

told my parents, I said, I'm, I'm done.

I'm done with this.

I didn't realize the cycle I was
doing, which was not applying myself

getting the d's, then it was giving
me the evidence that I was stupid.

Jethro Jones: So I want to stop there
for just a second because there's.

Uh, this is so fascinating to me because
I, I, I have a somewhat similar story,

uh, and then I went into education.

I often say that if my high school
teachers knew that I was an educator,

they would roll over in their graves
because there's no way that they would

believe that I would ever go down that
path based on how I was in high school.

And, and what's so interesting is
that you, you said something really

key there that you, you would fail,
um, to, for whatever reason and not

apply yourself, and then you'd see
that evidence and then it would become

this self-fulfilling prophecy, right?

That, that you would, you would say, well,
look, I obviously, I am dumb because I'm

getting these bad grades, even though, uh,
it, what I say now is that all grades are

made up and they don't even mean anything.

And so what's really fascinating is
that that is, that is probably the

worst possible measure to say that
you're dumb is a grade in school.

What it's really saying is that
you're not playing the game

that school wants you to play.

And, and once I personally
realized that, uh.

I figured out that
everything in life is a game

Becky Sampson: Mm-hmm.

Jethro Jones: and I just need
to play that game and understand

the rules of that game.

And when I'm not successful at it,
it's because I don't understand the

rules of that game and I'm not, uh,
I'm not applying myself to that game in

the way that it's meant to be played.

Becky Sampson: and isn't that so true?

I mean, I now, I mean now
all these years later, right?

I'm 51.

understand that game.

understand life a lot more.

And I remember even one of my professors,
uh, I attended BYU Hawaii just a few

years ago, and he did say that, he
says, you've got to understand the

rules of the game in life and in
business in order for you to play it.

And, and

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: it.

I think it's also, we all
are at different stages.

As a teenager or as a 7-year-old,
I didn't understand those things.

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: what's interesting
is working with people for all

these years later, always go back
to 'em and say, look, you did the

best that you could at that time
with the information that you had.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: And, and same
thing with your parents, right?

Jethro Jones: Yep.

Becky Sampson: mom, my mom was so
diligent in trying to teach me that I

was beautiful and that I was smart and
that I was, but nothing was getting

into my head like, are you kidding me?

Like, I, there's no way I remember
being 15 around, I, I just remembered

this, but being around 15 years
old, I actually ran away from home.

Um, I went to my girlfriend's
house for a couple hours, you

know, and uh, and came back.

But I really did run away
because eventually my dad

and I were very, very close.

Um, with summer camp.

I would always go when I was very, very
young with him to all these camp fairs.

And so we would be on road trips together.

I became very close to him
and my dad was also bipolar.

And, uh, what I didn't realize is,
is that I was kind of his little pet,

so to speak, and I was the one going,
yeah, dad dream and do all these

amazing things and, know, and my mom
was trying to keep the family together.

So

my father, I believe unintentionally
created this barrier between me and

the rest of my family because they're
like, Becky, nobody understands you.

I'm the only one that understands you.

And so I was then feeling
like everyone's out to get me.

Everyone's out to attack me.

And so my mom and I had a really bad
relationship and when I was 15, I mean, I

wrote her a letter, told her I hated her.

she was never my mother,
and wish she would die.

And

Jethro Jones: Wow.

Becky Sampson: and I
think she kept a letter.

My brother

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: ever bring it up.

But, and, and there was a good,
it does end, end well, but at, at

the time my mom, I was just like,
dad, I can't do this anymore.

And so I ran away to Utah and stayed
for, um, three months with my cousin

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: family.

Went to high school there until I
realized then at that point my parents

were kind of talking divorced and
I felt like I needed to come back.

Um, but I never was close to
my mom because I just felt so

misunderstood by everybody in my life.

I was trying to figure out who I was.

I remember at around 12 years older
or so, I would go out in our summer

camp and I would write these.

messages to myself, and then I would bury
them next to this rock and I'd bury them

and I'd listen to music and I'd do this
whole sit, you know, this whole thing.

I'd come back the next year not
knowing that, you know, disintegration.

I didn't, I was like,

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: And I,
you know, it disappeared.

So I, I was doing a lot
of self-development and

meditation and reflection.

As a child.

I've always been that way, trying
to figure out connecting the

dots trying to figure out myself,
trying to figure out the world.

Um, and the minute I graduated
from high school, I, I literally,

I was like outta there.

I was like, as soon as I could get
outta my house, I was like, I'm outta

here on my own, have my own job.

I was a very hard worker.

I have always been a really hard worker.

And, um, I got into an apartment by
myself with, well, with a girlfriend

of mine, um, and started my two jobs.

And I had always at a young age
decided I was gonna serve a mission.

when I was young, women
didn't serve missions.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Yep.

That's big change in
culture for the church.

Becky Sampson: yeah.

And so I, but I remember as a young age, I
wanted serve remission, but it was getting

closer and closer to that time where it's
like, okay, Becky, you gotta be serious.

Are you really gonna do this?

Like, and, and of course, you know,
throughout my, I had struggled.

With weight and all of that stuff,
um, back and forth and back and forth.

But when I was preparing for my mission,
my dad ended up, um, having an episode

of depression, which was not uncommon,
but this time it was even worse 'cause

he was at college and he broke down
in class and he was trying to make the

decision of whether or not he was gonna
go to the, to the Golden Gate Bridge and

jump off or if he was gonna drive home.

And he came home and our
family went into a tizzy.

My brother had just left for his mission.

little brother and I had another
four months, I think, four or five

months before I went on my mission.

And so my dad ended up
in a mental hospital.

And gosh, I haven't talked about
this for a really long time.

So,

Jethro Jones: Well, here we are.

Becky Sampson: Here we go.

And, and I, I mean, we knew my dad had a
mental illness, but I didn't understand

it because he was my hero and he was

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: to a lot
of kids at our camp.

He was a second dad, he was a grandfather.

I mean, still to this day, I had a
conversation the other day from somebody

that, I mean, they just idolized my dad.

So that's how I saw him.

seeing him in a weak moment
was really hard for me.

Jethro Jones: Well, and, and
here's another thing that

is, that is so fascinating.

We, we often think of our parents as, you
know, amazing or terrible or whatever.

But the reality is, is especially once
we get older and realize that they were

just struggling through life just like
we are, and like everybody before them,

and everybody after them, we're all
going to go through these struggles.

And, and it's so fascinating because we
think, well, especially when we're young,

this didn't happen in my household.

We didn't have these struggles.

Or if we did, then it's
like we, we downplay it.

Like it's not a big deal.

And then we realize that everybody goes
through these things and, and they're not

all exactly the same, but they are all
the same in a different perspective, which

is that we all have weaknesses and we all
have challenges and trials in our life.

And that's the whole point of our life.

And when you're young, it's easy to
think, you know, my parents are perfect,

or my parents are great, or whatever.

But then you don't, and then you become
an adult yourself and you're like, oh

my goodness, they were dealing with
this and I was such a terrible kid.

What is wrong with me?

I was horrible.

You know?

Becky Sampson: it's, yeah,
the cycle of life, right?

I mean, and I do think,
I do think that we.

We do e even now as adults, we have
a different perspective, but the more

we experience, the more the broader
and the bigger the perspective gets.

Um, I'm a very different person
now than I was back then.

I, I just, I, and, and oftentimes when
you're doing therapy and you're going

through that process, you go, okay,
what would you tell your 7-year-old

girl, you know, what would you tell her?

Knowing where you are now, know, you're
doing a great job, you know, and it's

okay that your brother rejected you it's
okay, and he probably was protecting you.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: He was probably
protecting you from this older group

of kids you took it a certain way.

And my mom and I have talked so
much about this is that, you know,

Becky, it wasn't that you grew.

And I was like, oh, they're so abusive
and they're so, and I look back and I'm

like, really grew up with an amazing life.

I mean, I grew up

Jethro Jones: yeah.

Becky Sampson: and then.

Every summer of my life, I got to go out
to, southern Utah and meet people from all

over the world, sleep under every star in
the universe and, and have all these crazy

adventures and almost die several times.

I mean, it's

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: I mean, then I'd go
back and I'd ask my best friend,

I'm like, what'd you do for summer?

She's like, uh, swimming.

I'm like, uh, I, I had, I have
an incredible, incredible life.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: And, but at that
time I didn't see that and I didn't

see the struggle that my mom had of
instability of my dad doing these

crazy ideas and buying things.

And, and she was like just doing her
best to keep the family together.

And, um, it wasn't really until my dad
was hospitalized where I really kind

of started seeing writing on the wall.

And I remember going to him and they said
that we couldn't bring anything breakable.

And it took my sister and
I, my sister above me and my

little brother are both blind.

They're legally blind.

They were born that way.

Jethro Jones: Wow.

Becky Sampson: was driving my sister
and I up to the hospital up in Menlo

Park, I think it was California.

And, um, we walked in and it was
just so, it was sad for me to

see my dad, um, in such a frail

place.

And um, for him to basically
say, don't judge me, know.

And my dad really, really,
we always looked at him.

He was always strong.

He was always, um, the one that you
go to, to fix things and, adventure

and fun and all of that stuff.

And here he was, um, really
contemplating his life.

And so several months after that, we had
to deal with the reality that my dad had

spent quite a bit of money my mom knowing.

And, and we had all this credit
card debt and, and everything.

And my sister and I would go to work
during the day and we'd come home.

And of course, um, uh, what's funny is
my mom, this is before computers and

all that stuff, when we were young,
she wanted us to learn how to type.

And so because my brother and sister
are blind, you know, we'd have this

thing where she, she built this
little block over our keyboard.

a

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: wasn't even a
keyboard, it was a typewriter.

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: so we, and so my
sister would, would, um, go and

type things into the computer, which
is like the, the first Mac, you

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: little tiny
'cause we lived in the Bay Area.

uh, she would type things into
the computer as I read them.

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: And um, and we
did express spreadsheets with

all this debt that we had.

we, people would be flying in.

And my dad was just devastated
that people knew what was

going on, the internal battle.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: And here I was
preparing to go on a mission.

I. And, um, and that about
five months later I get my

mission call to Idaho Pocatello.

And I was

Jethro Jones: Oh, wow.

Becky Sampson: I was like, uh, Idaho.

Like I was hoping to go to
France maybe 'cause I studied

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: you know, in
high school, parlay, bufon.

Um, but I ended up in going to par.

And, and there's a real reason why
I believe the Lord and many reasons.

And actually it goes back to
something that you said this morning

in your intro is, is that why we
stayed connected to the church?

And, and, and I'll circle back to that,
I got my mission to Idaho Pocatello.

And come to find out that's where my
parents, their first year of marriage was.

And then they were kind of trying
to, 'cause I was crying and I, I

still to this day have not found
the video that my dad took that day.

I opened my mission call.

'cause I literally was
like, are you kidding me?

Uh, and so they kind of
had to talk me into going.

anyway, I, I ended up going, uh, my
mom would write me every single day,

I'm sorry, every week of the mission.

my dad, every once in a
while I'd get a, a, from him.

But our mission president was
very, very unconventional.

He was a convert from Oklahoma
City and he was a bible bacher.

it was unusual.

You usually only get Mother's Day
and I think Christmas to call home.

But I got to call home
on Father's Day year.

And it was 1996.

I had only a couple months left
on my mission, and I called home

and talked to my dad, of course.

And then right after that I was
struggling with some, some companions.

he wrote me this beautiful
letter and he just said, Becky,

I've always believed in you.

He's like, out of all my
kids, you are a fighter.

And he goes, I worry least
about you, but, but don't tell

your other siblings, you know?

Jethro Jones: Yeah, classic dad.

Move.

Becky Sampson: Yeah.

Total classic dad move.

Right?

um, and he says, I believe in you.

I know who you are.

Don't let anybody dim.

My dad had been inactive the
last six years of, of, uh,

before I went on my mission.

And, um, and so it was, it was
precious what he was writing to me.

And then he said to me, he says, I know
I'm not supposed to be trunky, but I'm

really trunky for you to come home.

I miss our conversations
and I miss everything.

Well, a week before my mission
ended, um, I got a call

and, um,

and my, I got a call
actually from my cousin.

I think she's my cousin, my
cousin or aunt, I can't remember.

But I've never met her before in my life.

I was on my P day, uh, the week
before I was supposed to be released.

And there was a message on
my voicemail to call her.

And she lived, I actually went to
dinner with, or yeah, dinner with

her in Pocatello when I surfed there.

And I had already given back my calling
card and everything 'cause we were

finishing our mission and I, and we get
this message and I said to my companion,

I said, I, there's something not right.

I don't know what's going on.

I said, can I use your calling card?

And so I called her back and started
talking for a few minutes and she's

like, Hey Becky, I gotta call you back.

'cause she realized I
didn't know anything.

And um, and she called me back and she
told me that my dad had passed away.

He had died in a car accident

Jethro Jones: Oh.

Becky Sampson: the day after camp ended.

And, um, I just fell to the ground.

'cause my dad was like my hero.

He was,

he was the, it's funny, I don't, I don't
usually cry about my dad, but, you know,

um, ' cause it's actually a good story.

He's, he's been amazing to father
me from the other side of the veil.

But that day was, was a real
defining moment in my life.

And, uh, of course they put me on a plane.

The next day back to Utah.

My mom had flown to Utah.

We were gonna have the
funeral here in southern Utah.

And, um, I remember meeting with the
state president and he's like, you

better take that tag off right now.

I'm gonna wrestle you to the crowd
because I just wasn't ready, you know?

Um, and then we of course had
the funeral and amazing people

came from all over the world.

And I, I was de I was determined
that I was gonna see my dad and,

um, being a missionary and, and it
didn't happen and I was discouraged.

But I will tell you, for the next
year after that, I had so many

dreams of my dad coming back to me
just saying, you know what, Becky,

you know, you'll be just fine.

And, that was the beginning of my
mother and I repairing our relationship.

And I said to her at one point, I said,
I think dad needed to leave in order

for you and I to have a relationship.

And she and I are so we're best friends.

She called me the other day and she said,
Becky, there's only a couple of people.

There's only, I've only had two
best friends in my life, and one's

my sister and the other one's you.

And she wants me to speak at her funeral.

'cause she's like, you've gotta tell
this story, this miraculous story.

Um, but so, you know, as we, you
know, we've talked about things

that happened for a reason.

I am a hundred percent convinced that
my dad went when he was supposed to go.

And although would I love to have
him in my life, would I love to

have him be able to call him and
go on another road trip with him.

I have felt him so close to me
and guiding me 'cause he was such

an entrepreneur and I am too.

And I think like him, I
inspire people like him.

I, it was always my dream, um, to
take the best parts of my dad and,

and continue that in, in life.

Jethro Jones: Uh, yeah,
Becky, that that comment.

Take the best parts of our parents
and continue that in our life is the

dream of, I believe every parent out
there, like every parent knows that

it is, that they are not perfect.

And my dad, uh, he's, he told me when
I was like 15 or 16, he said something

along the lines of, um, that he didn't
have everything figured out yet.

Becky Sampson: Hmm mm.

Jethro Jones: I remember
thinking, man, what an idiot.

How can you not have things
figured out yet when you're,

mid forties, late forties, early
fifties, however old he was?

I don't remember exactly, but I remember
thinking, man, that really stinks.

And now here I am, 43 years old and I
am so confused about so many things.

And, and I remember thinking, man,
if I don't have my life figured out

by then, it's gonna be embarrassing.

But the difference is, is like the
one thing my dad was totally sure

about and that I am totally sure
about now is my faith in Jesus Christ.

Becky Sampson: Absolutely.

Jethro Jones: that is the,
the guiding principle.

And I don't worry about that aspect of it
because I know that he is my savior and

he can lead me back to Heavenly Father.

And the thing that's so amazing about that
is that my dad had a lot of problems, also

struggled with bipolar disorder in that.

But if I could take the best things
from him and pass those on and, and

emulate those things, then that would
be a great honor to him as my dad.

And same with my mom who's
still alive like your mom.

And like, those are the things, those
are the things I want to pass on to my

kids, the great things that my parents
did, and, just leave the negative things

behind because they weren't perfect.

None of them.

Becky Sampson: are how
we learn from, right?

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: I, I think that
I call those parental paydays,

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: um, is when a parent
sees the full circle the realization

where we wake up and go, oh my gosh.

Like you were trying to treat, my
mom was trying to teach me structure.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: what?

She goes, if I could have taught you
structure Becky earlier in your life, like

I was trying to do, but my dad was count.

He's like, Hey, forget
about the structure.

Let's go play.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: And, and so he wasn't
working in conjunction with my mom.

and so, and now that I have the
structure in my life, I embrace

it and my mom's like, yes, this

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: trying to tell you.

You were smart, you

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: beautiful.

You are like, and so it's a
parental payday for her, for her.

And it is, I love that you said that,
that it, it is honoring our parents.

Um, you know, my mom's had a real hard
time with camp, you know, our summer

camp because, and I finally said to
her a couple years ago, I said, you

know what, mom, the reason why I
think you have a hard time with camp

is because that was the other wife.

Jethro Jones: Mm.

Becky Sampson: My

Jethro Jones: Yep.

Becky Sampson: camp because
he was the hero there.

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: He wasn't a hero at home.

You were trying to hold things together
while he went out and changed the world

for all these youth around the world.

And it's

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: and so, and so.

It's, it's coming back to her and helping
her realize that her sacrifice that

she made has changed so many people's
lives and there's a ripple effect.

And so did it serve a purpose?

Yes.

Was it difficult?

Yes.

it some days that you wanna just give up?

Yes.

And, and, and one thing I loved about
my mom, I still love about my mom is,

is that even though I was a screaming
teenager, she would still come into my

bedroom and she would still pray with me.

I remember as a teenager, and I tell every
parent that I, that I talk to, or a coach

or any of this is that even though your
kids are giving you resistance, doing it.

Because I remember her leaving
my room one, one night after we

had knelt by my bed and prayed.

And she, I remember thinking to
myself, why am I so mean to her?

But you know what, thinking about it now
is I was set up to, to be mean to her.

dad was like, she doesn't understand you.

Don't be vulnerable with her.

You know, all.

And so I, I, I was under.

Influence.

And I don't think my
dad did it on purpose.

I think it was just he was trying
to navigate through everything

and keeping me tight to him.

'cause I was his, I was his cheerleader.

You

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Yeah.

Becky Sampson: And, and going back to
something that you also mentioned is,

I believe one of the main reasons, and
I'm even more convinced of it now, with

everything we've gone through in the last
several years, um, with people leaving

the church, I'm even more convinced that
one of the reasons why God sent me to

Idaho Pocatello mission was the majority
of my mission, was working with inactives

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: overage youth and
seeing what it does to a family

when they don't have the gospel.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: I am the first one
to tell anybody and everybody in the

world that the goss, the gospel's true.

That people in the church are not.

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: And, I remember I knocked
on a door one day, uh, and this guy

was, I think he was in his seventies.

I mean, it's all relative now, right?

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: he was
old, um, in his seventies.

And he was like, I've lived my whole
life in the church and I'm just done.

And I said, really?

You're gonna go all of
that time and then give up?

Like really?

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: And I've
also come to realize that

everybody's on their own journey.

It's not mine to judge

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: because
that's between them and God.

Jethro Jones: Yep.

Well, and to that point, everybody is
on their own journey and we, we, we

presume to know just because we know
that something's right, that everybody

else should understand it the exact same
way, and that's not the case at all.

And, and God understands that.

And so, and, and he understands
where people need to be and what

their journey is back to him,
and that it's their choice also.

Right.

That it's not our choice
or even his choice.

That's the gift of agency that he's
given us, that we get to choose

how we interact with him and, and
he doesn't ever force us to do it.

And that's not his plan.

Yeah.

Becky Sampson: is the plan.

And so people that push agency
someone and judgment is not the plan.

Jethro Jones: Yeah, exactly.

Becky Sampson: know, I, I work
with two gals right now that I'm

accountability partners and we do
videos back and forth one of them, I

mean, they're not LDS and I never, I
never force my, my religion on anybody.

but a conversation came up this last week.

She goes, well, how do I address
like my faith and like my followers?

And

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: higher power or
do I call it universe or Yeah.

I said, honey, just be yourself.

Jethro Jones: Yeah, totally.

Becky Sampson: don't push your
agenda, your religion, your

beliefs on anybody because that
is not God's and Christ's way.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Well, and

Becky Sampson: and invite.

Jethro Jones: yeah, and you
mentioned that your, your

mission president was a Bible ba

Becky Sampson: Oh,

Jethro Jones: and, and so another
thing that is very popular right

now is, um, is fighting online
about, you know, who believes what

and what's right and what's wrong.

And I never want to take that approach.

I don't ever want to get in those battles
with people because they're not productive

and I'm not going to convince anyone.

So I don't try to convince
anyone with what I'm doing.

I just share and then say, if you wanna
learn more, then let's, let's talk.

I love having deep doctrinal discussions
and debates, but never to, to convince

someone of something that I believe.

I, I just, I, I totally despise
that What I want is to testify

and to proclaim and not to, uh, to
fight or to have a, an argument.

I, I just wanna share what I believe
and let you do what you will with it.

And that's, that's the
approach that I've taken.

And, um, and, and I feel so much
peace being able to do that.

Now, I mentioned that I was a, a educator,
so I was in the public school system

and it was not appropriate for me.

To share my beliefs like
that, uh, in that position.

And now that I'm not, I'm very
grateful that I can be more myself

and share who I am, uh, more fully.

Becky Sampson: Right.

Jethro Jones: trying to figure out how
to do that, uh, in the best way that

I can, that's authentic to myself,
but also isn't like saying My way is

the only way, and if you don't agree
with me, then we have nothing to do.

Becky Sampson: and I've had go, I've had
to go on my own journey, my own faith

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: get to this point

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Me too.

Becky Sampson: I grew up in a,
I mean, obviously we didn't have

as many LDS people in California.

and so we were, I mean, many
times my friends in high school

would protect me from drinking.

I mean, I never got involved
in any of that stuff.

But, you know, even if I was like, well,
let me see the marijuana, you know, they

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: no, no, Becky,
you're LDS, you're Mormon.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Yeah.

Becky Sampson: so they would
protect me in that way.

Um, but I, and I've never really, but I've
had my own faith moments and I believe

what grounded me was, my mission allowed
me to serve and have compassion for these

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: who have been
offended and left the church.

Jethro Jones: Yep.

Becky Sampson: But, you know, you read in
the scriptures and you go, man, how many

of those guys were so against the church?

And then they came back and were
like, the best missionaries.

And so who are you to say,
or who am I to say that their

journey is not right or wrong.

I'm not playing God.

I can't play God.

And actually what's interesting is that.

The day that, so once I found
out that my dad had passed away,

I immediately called my mom.

I said, why didn't you call me?

She's like, well, we
didn't have your number.

I said, you did have my number.

I mean, so I started like
really getting upset.

I'm like, why did I have to
hear, but my dad passing away

from somebody I don't even know.

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: then next thing I
know, and my mission president was

just trying to out a bunch of stuff
before he came down to meet with me.

But he came down to meet with me
face to face and he says, Becky,

don't let this experience of your
dad's death you to go inactive.

What are you talking about?

Why would that go in?

Why would I go inactive about that?

so it's interesting.

I, I've never really been one that has
challenged the church until I've gotten

to some certain things in my life, and now
I've gotten to this beautiful, peaceful

place going, look, people are not perfect.

I cannot hold people to including
myself to this, this level of perfection

because that is not God's plan.

That is Satan's plan.

I refuse to be on his side and in my
work, um, line of work, there's a lot

of public speakers and a lot of coaches
who have straightaway the church and the

ones who are vocal about going to the
temple and about staying active, I reach

out personally to them and say, thank
you so much for continuing to just share

your personal beliefs and your life,
because you never know who's watching,

especially when you're in the public eye.

And I've had people come up to me
years later and say, Becky, I've been

watching you for years and I really
respect what you're doing, how you're

serving people, you know your heart
because I, I do the very best I can to

be as authentic and real as possible.

without throwing up on people.

I don't believe that that's the way
to share, but when you share, it's

a different energy than when you
are trying to convince somebody.

it's promotion that, and I don't know
about you, but I'm one of those people.

You tell me what to do and I'm like.

Screw you.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: I, I, and I've learned
through my processes and especially

through my divorces, that it's like,
if you wanna influence me, you say,

Becky, you might wanna consider,

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: wanna consider what you're
saying or you might wanna consider what

you're doing or you might wanna consider.

Then it's like, okay, great.

You're now giving me the agency
and the space to step back and go.

I'm gonna consider that.

I might give you a little kickback
at first, but just hang on.

Just like my husband last weekend
when we went, um, hunting.

And he got me up at 4 45 in the
morning in the freezing cold.

And I'm like, ah, but you know what?

Just hang in there.

Just I'll

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: And eventually
I was like, okay, this is fun.

You

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Becky Sampson: it's the
same way with the gospel.

So I, it's um, I mean, kind of
circling back to when I got back

from my mission, I, I, I didn't, my
life had just completely, um, right?

And my mom, for the first time, I was
sitting there on the phone trying to

register for my classes and for college.

And she says, Becky, 'cause I was going
for business entrepreneurial stuff and it

had a lot of math classes and I, I'm, I
didn't do well in high school that way,

even though I'm very smart that way.

I just didn't do well.

she says you might wanna consider
she did back then actually say, you

might wanna go into graphic design.

And I was like, that's way too much fun.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: Like, that's,
school's not supposed to be fun.

My

Jethro Jones: Interesting.

Becky Sampson: And, uh, sure enough,
I did change my degree and do graphic

design, and it's been the best thing
in the world, being an entrepreneur,

being able to do all my own branding and

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: and all my own stuff
from what I learned 30 years ago.

and so I, I went off to college and
went on my way and, and started,

you know, that whole journey of
dating and, getting engaged and

then breaking that engagement off.

And, um, all while I've been up and
down the scales, weight loss, you

know, I went on my mission 230 pounds,
came home and lost 50 pounds and then

engaged, then broke off the engagement.

and I thought my life was over.

When that first engagement,
uh, broke up, I literally felt

like I'm never gonna be loved.

And it took me a couple years until
I'd gained all my weight back again.

And here I was in that regards and
was rejected so many times by men

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: they would say,
Becky, I love your conversation.

I love, know, talking to you and being
friends with you, but I, I can't have a

relationship like the weight's an issue.

Jethro Jones: Hmm.

Becky Sampson: So that was just taking
another hit that I've been dealing with my

whole life until I met, my first husband.

I. Who threw himself at me, literally.

Like, just, the minute we met, he
just was like, oh my gosh, I love you.

I care about you.

I wanna be with you.

And I was like, I don't like you.

Like I, I,

Jethro Jones: The, the thing you've
been praying for happens and now

you're like, eh, I am not interested.

Becky Sampson: I just
wasn't attracted to him.

He was too much in my face.

Again, if you come at me like,
like you tell me that I have to do

something, I will be like, oh, heck no.

Um, and, and so he was like after
me for about a year and a half.

And then I went to an education
week, um, talk on judging people.

And I thought, okay, I'm gonna get my
little notebook out and do my evaluation.

I mean, Matt's not that
bad of a guy, but, okay.

So I did all this stuff and the
next thing I know, I come home

that night, I call him, and he
was living back east at that time.

um, and I said to him, I said, I love you.

Two weeks later, I was on a plane
to back east, and I said to my

mom, I said, I'm not, don't worry.

I'm not interested.

I'm just gonna kind of
just see what happens here.

And then within two days we got engaged.

Two and a half months
later, we got married.

Jethro Jones: Fast.

Becky Sampson: Yeah, and I was 29
years old and that was definitely

something I, I think I had gotten to
the point where I had been rejected by

so many men, that, and, and he just,
he didn't care that I was 230 pounds.

He just thought I walked on water.

He just thought,

Jethro Jones: Hmm.

Becky Sampson: but I didn't
feel that way towards him.

And, but looking back now, and
by the way, we've done a podcast

three years after our divorce.

Jethro Jones: Hmm.

Becky Sampson: a podcast, and I just
had my husband now actually listen

to it for the first time the other
day, um, we did an hour and a half

where we talked very openly, but
from the get go there was abuse.

Not only physical abuse,
but emotional abuse.

And I don't hide the fact
that I was abusive to him.

And

Jethro Jones: Hmm.

Becky Sampson: that you
usually hear from women

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: because, um, I
didn't know what I didn't know.

I knew that it was a really
unhealthy relationship.

Within a couple of weeks, I got pregnant,
um, and we didn't have insurance.

We didn't have, and, and ended up
having an ectopic pregnancy, three

miscarriages the first year of
our marriage and was in surgery.

Um, he, we were struggling financially.

We were communicating correctly.

Um, I was pushing him to
the limits emotionally.

He would then get violent and hit me.

Um.

We were married for seven and a half
years, went through a lot of fertility.

would have really good moments, but then
we would cycle and it would get crazy.

Um, but here's the back to the cycle of
what, when I was in junior high and, and

elementary school, I was tell myself that
I was stupid, so I wouldn't apply myself.

And then I'd get bad grades
and then it would reinforce

that idea that I was stupid.

I did the exact same thing
with that first marriage.

I would push my husband
emotionally till, till he broke.

Like I would like verbally attack
him and emotionally attack him

and spend, you know, people
say it's a narcissistic cycle.

I would like, it's all
you and da dah, dah.

I mean, I was just pushing
him away and pushing him away.

And really internally I was
upset with myself for marrying

somebody I didn't love.

And then he was the recipient of that.

And that push him, push and push
him, and then he would hit me and

then I'd go, see, you're abusive.

And it took us years for us to cycle back.

And when we did that interview,
it's called Healing From Divorce.

I actually need to put it on my
website so people can go to it.

But if you listen to that interview
between him and I, we had both cycled all

the way through where we could talk openly
the abuse and, and what we did to each

other because we didn't know any better.

And we cried together, we apologized.

We, we looked at the lessons that
we learned from that marriage and he

was devastated when I walked away.

he thinks I walked away.

I literally had to get outta
that cycle of abuse 'cause I

didn't feel safe, nor did he.

And he even admitted on this podcast
that he's, I was afraid to be vulnerable

and own up to any of my stuff for
fear that he would use it against me.

And he said, I would've,
at that time, I would've.

so that's a very, very unusual experience
that most couples don't get a chance

to, is to cycle back and process.

But he, I was so grateful that
he was willing to do that.

And he had now been
remarried at that time.

Um, I went through a
lot of self-development.

I lost 130 pounds towards the
end of our marriage, which he

changed the dynamics of things.

And when we did this interview, my
girlfriend did the interview for us.

that was the first time I think he had
seen me personally with all my weight off.

Jethro Jones: Hmm.

Becky Sampson: and when I lost all
my weight, all of a sudden I started

getting all this attention from men.

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: And I thought, oh
my gosh, like, this is not fair.

I mean, it's not fair that I've been
the same person Um, however, I was now

having men run after, at gas stations,
running after the door to open it up for

me, you know, and now we're asking me
on dates and were just enamored by me.

And, and what I didn't realize is I
was this beautiful woman all along.

I just didn't know it.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

And, and how interesting that the,
the, the weight loss helps you

see your own beauty that is innate
in you as a divine daughter of

God that every single woman has.

And there's something that prevents
women from seeing their beauty and

men from seeing their masculinity
and, and beauty as well, that some

weakness that prevents us from seeing
ourselves how God sees us, which is as

beautiful, amazing creations of his.

And, and that is a tragedy
for the whole human race.

Becky Sampson: Well,

Jethro Jones: And yet it's
also part of the plan.

Becky Sampson: Yeah.

Let, let's take it back to Satan and
as easy and simple as, basic as Satan's

plan versus God's plan in Christ.

Right.

is that, so for me it
was a food addiction.

I use food as my drug.

I, I was introduced to a 12 step program
for food addiction, totally free.

It's a worldwide organization.

I can't name it 'cause they won't let me.

Publicly, but you can go look at it.

Um, and I got introduced and I, I
mean, it changed everything for me.

Once I got off the sugar and the flour, I
realized that was Satan's way of keeping

me from seeing what God saw in me.

I'm not saying that that's true
for everybody, but for me it was.

I mean, within a week or two of me
being on this program, we have a

very specific food program and it
doesn't include sugar and flour.

All of a sudden I was
like, oh my gosh, this.

Um, I'll tell that story real quick
because my girlfriend and I, she's,

she's now 86, she's four foot 11
Filipino, just a one of my best friends.

were walking in the mall
in Orum during winter.

I was married to my first husband at the
time and I had tried Weight Watchers, I've

done all that other stuff, and she had
turned to me and she goes, Becky, I've I,

I've had four cookies and I'm going crazy.

I need a detox.

And I'm thinking four cookies.

Like, that's it.

you kidding me?

Like maybe two bags.

And then I would think to
myself about getting a detox.

And she goes, you know what,
this is a Thursday morning.

um, she goes, tomorrow there's a
conference down in Vegas for this.

12 step program.

And I, I was 130 pounds overweight at the
time, you know, I'm five foot seven, so

you, I mean, anyway, you can just imagine.

we were walking down the mall
and she goes, we need to go.

I need to go.

You wanna come with me?

Do you wanna support me?

Come with me.

she's an enroller.

She, I was like, what?

Like, I've gotta work.

And I was a manager at an
apartment complex, a very large

one in Provo for many years.

And, uh, she goes, Becky, you're the boss.

Call it off, let's go.

And I'm like, no, you know?

And so we kept walking, kept walking.

I went home, didn't even
think anything about it.

The next day go walking again
and she's like, Becky, we

gotta leave like in an hour.

If we're gonna go, we're gonna go.

I'm like, what?

Are you serious?

So I went home, I walked in
my apartment, I looked at my

husband and I said, I don't know.

Pat wants me to go to this thing.

I don't even have the money for it.

It's like 55 bucks or whatever.

She's gonna pay for it.

I have no idea where we're gonna stay.

And, uh, but she's picking me up.

I'm gonna go to work and tell
him I'm gonna take the day off.

And we did.

We took off and we headed towards
Vegas, which is a five hour drive.

We get down there, we got
there a little bit late.

And so we were registering and there
was a lady at the front of the room

and she was telling my story, and
I was like, I, I remember stopping

myself from writing the registration.

And I looked up at her and she was
talking about when she would babysit

kids when she was a kid, she cared
more about the food in the house than

the kids that she was caring for.

I was like, what?

I mean, I had never heard
anybody even mention that out

loud like else felt that way.

'cause every time I got asked to
babysit, I'm like, Ooh, I wonder

what kind of food they have.

'cause in my family it was all hidden.

You know?

I had to go searching and finding,
know, every time that you babysit

they're like, Hey, help yourself
to anything that you want.

I'm like, are

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: Like, 'cause all these
much cheese and crackers and candy

and everything that you have in there.

And then I feel really embarrassed
'cause I'm like, oh, they're never

gonna invite me back, you know?

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: I, she stopped me
in my tracks and I looked into this

room of about 300 people sitting
there listening to her talk.

And I thought to myself,
what the heck is this?

Like, who are all these people
and who, what are they doing?

And uh, it only took a couple more
people standing up and telling

their stories for me to realize.

I'm like, okay, I've been able
to lose weight a lot, but I've

never been able to keep it off.

And these people had kept
it off for 10, 15, 20 years.

And I was like, I, it only
took me a couple hours for

me to turn to my girlfriend.

I said, I don't know what this
is, but I, I need to do it.

And she's like, no, no, no.

Becky, you'll know when you're ready.

I'm like, I'm compulsive.

Let's go.

Like, let's, let's do it right now.

And so I found the one lady in the
room who had lost over 200 pounds and

I was like, alright, I'm, I'm going
straight to her to see if she can

sponsor me 'cause you have to have a
sponsor in order to do this program.

And so I went right up to her
and I said, okay, I'm gonna be a

really hard case 'cause I'm really.

I mean, I've been up and down this scale
so many times and been on every diet

and Becky, that's not how this works.

It's about learning how to love and accept
yourself and it's doing all the internal

work that's caused you to go to the food.

And I was like, what?

Anyway, long story short I got on the
program, it wasn't a perfect journey and

uh, we didn't have any meetings in Utah.

Uh, my girlfriend and I, this the
86-year-old now, uh, Filipino, her and

she came to me that day and she goes,
we need to start a meeting in, in Utah.

And we did.

And it ended up going to eight
meetings, ended up 150 people

in Utah, huge organization.

And I ended up losing the 130
pounds and down to a size two.

I actually got really tiny
and uh, but it changed the

dynamics with my first husband.

Um, and like I said, it changed the
way that I saw myself and I ended

up having to do a lot of mirror
work, intuitively sitting in front

of the mirror just going, who am I?

Like, and I, I'd sit and I'd hit my
face like this in front of the mirror

and I'm like, this is just a meat suit.

It's not who I am.

It's what I am.

This body is, is a, is explains
a journey I've been on.

And so.

really went inward in doing a
lot of writing and a lot of, um,

searching to God to, bring my value place
I, I wanted to know that I was valuable

at 266 pounds and I was also a valuable
at 135 pounds, you know, and that is the

greatest lie that Satan wants us to think
that the outward world gets to determine

our value on the inward in inside world.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Well, and, and to that point, the
Satan will use anything that he can.

Becky Sampson: Anything.

Jethro Jones: To make us
feel unworthy of God's love.

And, and understanding that, and knowing
that anytime you feel unworthy of God's

love, that is Satan's, uh, uh, tactic.

And so anything that makes you
feel that way is, is from Satan.

And you can very easily
identify that every single time.

That doesn't mean that it's
like actually easy to do it.

That is the simplicity of it.

Anything that makes you feel
unworthy is Satan's tactic.

And so if that's the case, then you
have to be able to, to see that and

say, oh, this is just Satan trying to
get me down and turn again to Christ,

to the atonement to overcome that
and to be able to have the strength

to continue on whatever that is.

And it doesn't matter 'cause
it's anything and everything.

Mm-hmm.

It's.

Becky Sampson: And it's interesting
because years after I got divorced

from my first husband, it, I would
say it's probably only been about six

years, he came in and met with my mom.

'cause he needed to pick something
up that I had found in my stuff.

And he sat down with her and
he had this great insight.

'cause I will say my first
husband was a very deep thinker.

I really appreciate that about him.

And he said to him, she goes, no,
I've realized, you know, in the

church where it says, and in the
scriptures it says, um, thou shall

not take the Lord's name in vain.

Well, one of the Lord's names is, I am.

And so when you say, I am stupid,
I'm dumb, I'm ugly, I am not enough.

That's all.

Taking the Lord's name in vain
because you are enough, are

smart enough, you are beautiful.

I don't care what your out
outward appearance looks like or

what the world tells you or not.

You know, it's really important with what?

With the internal dialogue.

And when that, and I have,
I still have my days.

I really do have my days where
it's like, oh, I can't do this.

Why is it so easy for
everybody else and not for me?

And, you know, why am I, I,
I have my own self-doubt.

And then my husband now is so good
at reminding me, Becky, Satan.

that's right.

Satan talk is getting to me and
I need to say enough is enough

and I'm not allowed to do that.

But to take you back to, I, there's a
story that I wanted to share too is that

day before I started my food program,
my girlfriend and I went to the temple.

We did a session and I couldn't, I
couldn't stop thinking about what

these people had talked about in this
conference like, never again, no,

no sugar, no flour ever, ever, ever.

Like I just, no, no sugar.

No.

And I know, I know we should be
concentrating on the temple ceremony.

And at the, I mean, thinking
to myself get to the celestia

room, um, I said, really?

I can never have sugar again.

Like ever.

And she goes, Becky, just not today.

And I was like, oh, okay.

So I only have to do it for today because.

That's like someone telling
me that my best friend, I

can't ever talk to him again.

You know what I mean?

I can't ever see them again.

but she says, just for today, and then
almost immediately after that, the

Lord gave me this incredible vision.

And I don't know if you've
been in the, the Vegas temple,

but it looks like a boat.

The celestial room.

It comes to a point, all of a sudden
in my mind's eye, I could see and

hear this beep, beep, beep beep,
this dump truck coming and coming

through the wall of the temple, of
that celestial room and dump, dumping

trash from the floor to the ceiling.

I turned to my girlfriend and I
said, what do you think would happen?

Literally would happen to the spirit
right now if a dump truck came through

and dumped all this trash in here?

And she goes, the spirit would be gone.

in that second, and in that moment,
the Lord taught me, Becky, that's

what you've been doing to your body.

You wonder why you haven't been able to
feel and understand God's divinity that is

in you you've been defiling your temple.

And I was like, what?

Like that was such a defining
moment for me, and I was, he's

like, you're opening up your gates
and you're dumping all this trash.

And the spirit would be gone.

It just goes.

And, and then I started realizing,
oh my gosh, how does Satan

take the people in the church?

'cause we don't typically drink.

I mean, there's people that drink
and smoke and all of this stuff,

but I'm thinking, wow, how many
relief society, cookbooks have been

around cookies and cakes and, and
potatoes and all of this stuff.

And how many people in the temple
are obese and can hardly even stand

long enough to serve or can't?

All of this stuff and how many
obesity um, the church and speak to

the people because they wanted to
know my story and my perspec perspective

on why they were having to turn away
so many people to serve missions.

And I'm thinking, wow, Satan is tricky.

He is so tricky.

And what do we do in relief
society when we have our lessons?

We turn and we pass around all this candy.

And I'm not saying that it's
that it's everybody's problem.

Okay.

But it was my problem.

It was my addiction that
kept me from hearing God.

And I'm telling you, within a couple
weeks of being off that sugar,

I had a connection with God that
I had never truly felt before.

And.

That is why I went crazy
talking to me about 12 Step.

And I had Bishops going, Becky,
stop talking about 12 Step.

I'm

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: do you understand?

12 Step is just the atonement.

Do you

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: I don't care what the
addiction is, I don't have any judgment

to anybody with any addiction because all
it is is an an avoidance of having to deal

with what's really going on in an emotion.

And it causes them to go to anger, to
go to drugs, to alcohol, to pornography,

to whatever the addiction is.

Their brain works just like mine.

And when I got into recovery, I really
started understanding what the atonement,

I understood what Ether 1227 is.

Bring your weakness to me,
Becky, and when you bring your

weakness to me and surrender it
to me, I will make you strong.

Now all of a sudden, sugar and flour
didn't call out my name because I was

partnering with God in that journey.

Jethro Jones: Well, and you said
something that your friend said, you

don't have to give it up forever,
just today, and it doesn't have to.

Um, when you think about forever,
then it becomes overwhelming and

like, oh, I can never do this again.

And the reality is with the atonement is
there for us to be able to make mistakes

and not ruin everything because of that.

Becky Sampson: Right?

Jethro Jones: so it's not just
about the addiction, but just

about anything that you're, that
you're doing, just do it today.

Becky Sampson: Yeah.

Jethro Jones: if it, if you have to
just do it for the next five minutes.

Becky Sampson: I, I cannot
tell you honestly how impactful

that one concept was for me.

People go, well, how'd
you lose 130 pounds?

It wasn't, I wasn't
looking at it 130 pounds.

I was literally looking at one pound a day
or one pound at a time, and one day at a

time, and sometimes one meal at a time.

And that is how I've had to apply
that to all the other challenges

that I've had since that.

I mean, that was, gosh, I started that
journey 15, 16 years ago, and I, I've

had way more challenging things and
I've had to be like, okay, so just for

today, I'm gonna feel this emotion.

Even if, if people struggle and you
having a dad that's bipolar, I don't

know if you're experiencing this too,
but I'm really sensitive to my mental

health because I'm very aware that it's
hereditary and I, I do not want to be,

um, I, I wanna protect that mental health.

And so that one day at a time and applying
that to all aspects of life, that, and

Satan, I think will teach us, oh, look
at this big boulder and look at this

huge thing that's going on in your life,
and you're, you might as well give up.

Who cares?

Like just, and, and that he, he wants to
pin us into a corner we do give up and,

and God's going, are you kidding me?

I'm right here.

you what you need, when
you need it, you need it,

Jethro Jones: That that
piece is, is so true.

He, he's.

Ready to give us exactly what
we need, when we need it.

And, and he's waiting to give it to us.

And

Becky Sampson: to it.

Jethro Jones: Yes, exactly.

Because it could be sitting there
right in front of us and us, and we

don't see it because we're not paying
attention because we're not open to it.

And so he could have the answer right
there in front of us and, and we are

avoiding it or ignoring it or whatever.

Becky Sampson: Well, that's
because he values agency.

That's what we fought
for in the preexistence.

And, and because he values that
agency, he cannot give us what

we are unwilling to receive.

And so being open, it's just like, kind of
back to what we were talking about before.

If you're gonna share the gospel,
why are you trying to share the

gospel for somebody that's not open?

Like it, it doesn't.

Now, if they're open, and you
can even ask them, are you open

to a different perspective?

Are you open to me sharing with you how,
what my experience has been with Christ

or with God, or with the Temple, or
with my testimony, or there's journey.

If you are a great, I'll share it.

If not, I'm okay.

I don't need agency.

You know, my mom's an artist and she.

I, I've been trying to get her to, to
turn this into the church because she has

this huge chart that's like 15 feet long.

I mean, it's like she's put
her testimony on this huge

chart of the plan of salvation.

And, and I can't tell you how many
parts in that journey from pre-existence

all the way to Kingdom is all agency.

I mean, she writes it in red.

She, I mean, it's all over this chart.

Agency, agency, agency, you know,
and we need to give that, and it's

the same thing with marriages.

I mean, I'm gonna say this in
relationships and marriages because, um,

when you, when you get into
relationship, when I get into

relationships, we are always a choice.

We're a choice.

Who we become, we are a choice.

How we treat each other, how we
choose to see the other person.

Um, and, and that was one thing that
really shifted my heart is after my first

divorce, I started dating all these guys
that tell me these nightmare stories.

And, and I think they just, it was
really important to me 'cause I didn't

create a safe space for my husband,
that it was very intentional that when

I started dating, I would create these
very safe spaces for these men to be men.

Because we were losing, we're
losing the masculine part of men.

Women are becoming so masculine.

And I was too, I was very
masculine in my first marriage.

And I actually went and learned how
to dance my divorce because I needed

to lean into that femininity and
lean into the masculinity, andrus it.

And so I started writing a book.

Um, well, there's several things that
I started doing, um, in writing a book

called, um, love Like Lady, which was
all the stuff that I learned from all

these men that I had met the things
that they had wanted in relationships.

And a big one that came out
of that was appreciation.

And, and I have, I can't even
tell you how many men started

crying on the first dates.

And I said to him,

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: if, if I have to
coach you, I certainly can't date

you 'cause it's just, you know, I'll
be your friend and whatever, but I

just, I, I, I can't have that anyway.

So I, I was actually single for
eight years and dated a lot of

men and heard a lot of stories.

Um, did a lot of really good men.

And, and then eventually, and I, at that
point I was doing a lot of radio, tv.

Um, I got into TV later on,
but radio, because that was

my one avenue that I could go.

And I remember the first time I did
my radio, I cried before, I don't know

about you, but when my girlfriend turned.

Asked me to host her show.

And it was a real radio show.

I went into the studio and everything
and I'm like, what do I talk about?

And she was like, three, two.

And I'm just like, in tears.

I'm like, I have no idea what to talk
about I have no idea who's listening.

And I told her, I'm like, well, do you
know how many people are listening?

She goes, it doesn't
matter, Becky, just talk.

And I was like, and so people were
like, wow, you do radio and this is

before podcasts or, I'm like, yeah, I
talked to a microphone for two hours.

It's pretty sexy.

So, um, and I have no idea like
what's gonna happen with that.

But it got me into the public
eye and started speaking

and doing coaching programs.

And a lot of people were coming to me
for weight loss just because of my story.

But it was difficult for me to make
money doing that because I did it

through a step program, which was free.

I even moved to Ireland
and spent a year there.

I'd never been outta the country.

but I realized I worked with, um,
it took me three years to realize

that they were crooks and they were
taking people and they were using

my good name and my good story and
my goodwill, because people trust me

almost immediately when I meet them.

That's just who they are.

That's who I am, I should say.

Um, they needed that.

order for that business to go.

But it, it also taught me a lot
about life in, it opened my eyes

to be not as trusting of people.

Um, and I hate to say that, but it's,
that's when I started going, okay, I need

to start vetting people like in my life.

I'm not just gonna open the
door and let anybody in.

Um, but I came back from that a
little bit more, um, focused on

how do I serve and help people?

And one of the things that came to my
mind today when you were talking about

the 10 years, was I truly believe that
every single one of us has a purpose.

And a, mean, God.

God sees our strengths and he sees
our weaknesses, and he sees the

people that he wants us to serve.

And I oftentimes have my coaching
friends call me when they're in the

middle of their disaster, and they're
just like, Becky, why is this happening?

Why?

And I'm, and I am a real, real true
believer every single thing that you go

through is happening for you, not to you.

And when it's happening for
you, then what's the lesson?

Jethro Jones: Yep.

Yeah, I, I, this, this piece
is, is so valuable and we gotta

take a second to talk about it
because if, if you think that.

That these things are happening
for any reason other than for

you, then it is devastating

Becky Sampson: Absolutely

Jethro Jones: because if, if
you think that it's because of

something you've done, you've done,
then you're, you're gonna have

guilt, uh, and shame around that.

If you think that it's because of
something somebody else has done,

then you're gonna be a victim.

But if you are like, Hey, this is to
prepare me for whatever God has in store

for me, then it is empowering to go
through trials and it is hopeful to go

through trials and it totally changes the
game because it, it makes it so that you

are seeking and looking for the blessings
in God's hand in those little things

instead of thinking that they are, somehow
there's this weird, like, fate thing

that happens that is you have no control
over, you are given these opportunities

for your profit and learning, and

Becky Sampson: or

Jethro Jones: that's amazing.

Becky Sampson: Or

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: like

Jethro Jones: Okay.

Talk about that

Becky Sampson: so what I'm saying is,
is that you, God allows us to experience

these things to learn and to grow or.

We can choose not to grow through them.

Jethro Jones: exactly.

Becky Sampson: I'm saying.

They're there for you if you want to learn
and grow through it, or you'll stay stuck.

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: of the things that
just came to me too, a story,

um, after my husband and I, my
first husband, we had done that

interview, remember that three years

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: we did the interview.

He, he came by my apartment for
some reason, I can't remember.

And, um, or maybe it was
before that, I can't remember.

Anyway, he came to me and, um, and
we had a wonderful interaction.

And, and I turned, I was, I
used to have a porch swing on

my condo where we used to live.

one time I was listening
to a song called Wicked.

Have you ever heard that song?

Wicked?

Um, for Good.

Jethro Jones: No, I don't think I have.

Becky Sampson: got, you gotta, like,
I, I, I've heard that song before

many, many times, but for some reason
that day I heard every single word.

And basically the song means meaning.

Look, we came into each other's
life for a reason and a season,

and I may never see you again.

However you left an impact in my
life because I'm better because.

I met you.

That's the message I got.

I thought, oh my gosh, that's the
reason why I went through all of

that craziness in my marriage.

And, um, and, and so then I started
writing messages to him texting

him, saying, thank you so much.

And he was like, so confused.

He was like, why are you like, and
I'm like, no, no, no, I get it.

I now get it.

That it was supposed to be because he
really, that relationship, um, beat

the hell out of me, meaning the part
of me that I needed to address the

part of me that that was, that was low
self-esteem, that didn't understand

who my val, what my value was.

that hellish part out that was in me at
that point, I was able to process because

he was instrumental in standing in that
space as we went through this together.

And so did, I I I, at that point, and
this is what I say to people coming

outta divorces is, or any difficult
relationship is, is that you look

back, the, the sweet spot is when you
can get to love acceptance, um, and

appreciation for that relationship,
and then now you're ready to move on.

And that was, that was a
really big moment for me.

Um, it took him a little bit longer
to get there, then when we did our

interview, he's like, I got, I, I get it.

I get it.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: still, he goes,
I'm still on the journey.

It doesn't, is a journey,
not a destination.

That's a very cliche thing to say, but
if you really, really understand that,

it's same thing with my weight loss.

Just because I hit my goal weight
for the first time in my life.

I quit my job divorced all in
the same month of July, 2010.

Jethro Jones: Wow.

Becky Sampson: I literally, I, I mean, I
re I did a total reset, it was interesting

when, when I started struggling with
my weight again, I'm like, oh, this

is a des this is not a destination.

Like I have to keep working at it.

I have to keep myself.

And so that's an important thing to
think is that, you know, and when

it's really happening for you, then
I like to do a lot of journaling.

I don't know about you, but I, I
write, or I, I even use a lot of audio.

I'll do videos for myself,
nobody else, but for me.

And I'll start just processing and
going, Hey, what, what does that, you

know, what was that supposed to mean?

And, you know, what we talk about in
the church about pondering, but Satan

likes to keep us really, really busy

Jethro Jones: Oh, a amen.

I You go ahead and say what
you're gonna say, but I got a

lot to say about this right now.

Becky Sampson: well,
we're gonna, we're gonna,

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: look, we'll talk
about it because, because if he

can keep us busy and, and when we
go to the temple, we slow down.

When we go to nature, we slow down.

And so if, and, and this happens with
families, with kids, with careers,

with everything like you and I,
I, I mean, I'm so busy right now.

However, I have a beautiful
husband now who, who says,

look, we gotta take a break.

We're unplugging for three days.

We're gonna,

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: like, okay.

Awesome.

yes, talk about that, uh, what your
experiences in, in unplugging to

Jethro Jones: Well, it, so I'm
listening to this amazing podcast

called The Ancient Tradition, which
I suggest to everybody check out.

And it talks about the, that God
revealed his truth to, uh, the ancients

long ago, like Adam and Eve and to
other early ancient people in all

over the world and, and the, what
she calls the stubborn bits of that

have persisted all throughout time.

Becky Sampson: Mm

Jethro Jones: And the thing that's really
fascinating is that they understood

things that we still don't understand.

And the only way that they could
understand them was spiritually because

they didn't have the math and the science
and the technology to be able to tell.

And so things like how the stars
worked and, and all that kind

of stuff, they understood what
astrophysicists are just now.

Starting to get a, get a grasp on.

And, and it's so fascinating
because they didn't have all the

technology and stuff that we have.

And I keep thinking there's, the
world is telling me that I need to

do all these things to provide for
my family and, and take care of them.

And what I really have to do is
surrender and let God put those things

in my life that need to be there.

And, and that has taken a
tremendous amount of faith.

And the thing that it really
requires is the trust in him

that he's going to make it work.

And also taking time to step away
from all the distractions and all

the things that are trying to get my
attention and be still and just listen

to what he is trying to tell me.

And so I do these things.

I, I walk to the gym.

It's a mile from my house.

I walk there every morning and I exercise.

And many mornings I do
what I call prayer walks.

Becky Sampson: Mm.

Jethro Jones: And so I'm, I'm praying
as I'm walking and it is when I kneel to

pray before bed or, or in the morning or
any other time, I. I'm doing it to bless

a meal or to get ready for something,
and I rush through it, and I do not give

it the time and attention that it needs.

Uh, but when I do prayer walks, I, I
know I've got the next 20 minutes to walk

that mile that I can just talk with God.

And, and

Becky Sampson: Love that.

Jethro Jones: taking that time away
and letting everything just not, not

worry about it, is, is really powerful.

And, and I've been thinking a lot lately
that I, I'm so busy and I'm trying

to do so much and I need to just calm
down and relax and disconnect and not

be so, so hyperconnected all the time.

So I'm trying to not have my phone
with me at all during parts of the day.

I'm trying to put my phone
away earlier at night.

I'm trying to not be on social media and
all these things that, that take me away.

I'm trying to read more and think
deeper about things and, and

that pondering is so important.

And, and the key thing is, is
that it's not just about pondering

as in just thinking randomly.

It's about being open to the
revelation whenever it comes and

Becky Sampson: intentional.

Jethro Jones: yes.

Becky Sampson: the thing
is, is that, and I, I, amen.

Okay.

Amen to what you've said.

The Lord cannot communicate
with us unless we're silent.

Now, I shouldn't say that.

He, sometimes however, we
get more inspiration when

we're silent and when we're

Jethro Jones: I, I'll say it this
way, we, the Lord, can, can and is

communicating with us all the time.

Becky Sampson: true.

That's true,

Jethro Jones: We cannot hear him
when we're not silent and still.

And so he is, he is constantly ready.

So let me share this brief thing.

I, I moved, I live in Spokane, Washington.

I moved here five years
ago, um, almost to the day.

And I also graduated high
school from here because I moved

outta my house at 15 or 16.

Uh, like you did.

I lived with my sister for the
last two years of high school.

Also barely graduated high school.

So, so we have that in common also.

Yeah.

So, um, so I graduated from high school
here and ever since I moved here, I have

had these dreams that I am, that I am back
in school and I'm fighting against it like

I am back in high school again and again.

And, and this has been happening.

Uh, at least monthly
for the last five years.

And these dreams are so vivid
and so real there, there's

gotta be something else to it.

So literally on Monday morning, I woke
up from another one of these dreams

and I was like, God, why am I still
having these dreams and clear as day?

Uh, the, the lesson came, you
are in a doctoral program.

You are supposed to be doing
your doctoral program right now.

And this is for, it doesn't make any
sense why I am doing a doctor right now.

It really doesn't.

Becky Sampson: Hmm.

Jethro Jones: And the Lord was so clear.

You, you are having these
dreams because you are supposed

to be getting your doctorate.

So quit your complaining and whining
about it and, and finish it because

I just finished all my coursework
and I just have my dissertation left.

And let me tell you, it makes no
sense why I'm in this program.

It does not help me professionally,
at least that I can see.

And, and in that stillness of me just
waking up and saying What's going on?

Becky Sampson: You asked
the right question.

Jethro Jones: Yes.

And

Becky Sampson: You know, the interesting
I, I've learned that too, is that,

and, and I have a friend of mine that
I met many years ago that was so good

at asking God the right question.

I'm like, ah, can you
make a book for me like

Jethro Jones: out.

Becky Sampson: that?

I can ask.

'cause you know, we, you
ask the right question.

You're like, help me understand

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: I'm experiencing this.

What am I supposed to be learning?

How am I supposed to be growing?

And, and that's funny that you said
that too, because after my dad died,

I was only a week left my mission.

But I, I had, can't even tell you how
many times I dreamt about me going back

and having to finish my mission, like.

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: It's like, what?

I mean, I was back in my mission.

I'm like, how do I explain this?

And I can't tell you how
many dreams I've had.

I mean, I just told my husband today,
or a couple days ago that I used

to dream for the last 15 years that
I was back with my first husband.

And I had to explain to people
why I was back with him.

I, I mean, so, so dreams.

You know, God does communicate
to us in those dreams.

if we're not paying attention,
that's what I, I guess that's my

point, is that you said we have to
be still and being paying attention.

I'm definitely gonna do your, the,
the prayer, rock prayer walks,

because is a time that, and I don't
know, he talks to me in the shower.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: mean, it's, so, it's
those times where you're like, you

just are totally, I don't know.

And then a thought comes in and goes,
oh my gosh, even with the way that you

and I communicated or, or got connected
because you interviewed somebody

you didn't know why you were doing

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: and then it might
be a good fit for, for me and

the business that I'm doing now.

But it's like, he, you are right.

He's always communicating.

I call him God drops

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: because I'm like,
okay, God, I know that was you.

know you, you created this communication
or this connection, or whatever.

And I, I learned it the most.

Let me just kind of tell you a little
bit more about my story and then you'll

see why I, I. feel like that's probably
one of the greatest things and why a

lot of the prophets and the apostles
are saying, we need to hear him.

need to hear him.

And in order to hear him, you know, he
communicates differently with everybody.

However, it's a very
personal relationship.

But when I, um, I, so I was single for
eight years and, um, I had circled, I

was going for a trip down to Vegas again.

I guess.

That's funny.

Let's going to Vegas for a business trip.

And I happened to look up who I knew in
St. George and I knew a friend of mine.

so I looked him up and he's
like, Hey, yeah, we should go

dancing and blah, blah, blah.

And, and uh, it just so happened that I,
um, he lived down there and he's like,

why don't you come stay at night and we'll
go dancing and take you out and whatever.

And, um, we ended up, started dating,
um, and shortly after we started

dating, um, he was much older than
I was and we just had a lot of fun

and he, we ended up getting married,
um, a year after we started dating.

Um, it was kind of an interesting
journey because I had doubts

kind of all up against that time.

But we did end up getting married.

We went to, um, Hawaii on our honeymoon.

And I told him when we first got married,
I said, look, um, this is my last rodeo.

I'm not doing this again.

You know, and he had
been single for 20 years.

And we went to Hawaii.

We were there for a month and the very
last day that we were in Hawaii, he

was a retired, retired police officer.

And we were at the Polynesian
Culture Center and we were talking

to some missionaries, some senior
missionaries, and they're like,

oh my gosh, you need to come here.

They're looking for security.

Come work with us at the PCC.

And I remember leaving
that day going, what?

Like, we just got married like
three weeks, four weeks before that,

and wanted us to move to Hawaii.

Um, and we came back, we thought about
it and it was a couple more months.

And, and he was determined.

He's like, we're, we're
moving to Hawaii like that.

We're gonna do this.

It's gonna be fun.

And, and I was like, wow, this is,
you know, I was at the time doing

a lot of coaching and, and wanted
to get my coaching program going.

And this was a total derail, right?

Like, I'm gonna go to Hawaii and
I'm gonna, um, I knew two people on

the island, a gal that, that her dad
used to be my bishop and her husband.

'cause I used to be their
real estate agent in Utah.

And so I was in communication with
them a lot and going, oh my gosh,

I think we might get this job.

And um, that was in July or June.

And they offered him the job in
July or in, uh, sorry, December.

And gave him two weeks to go.

Get moved and I'm thinking, holy schmoley,
uh, I, I said, why don't you go ahead

and then I'll stay behind and get
everything ready and get a renter and get

the house all fixed up and everything.

And sure enough, he went, I went
out once and then went out twice, I

guess, but I stayed behind for about
three and a half months from the

minute we got married, this husband.

Um, and I was, I was at my goal
weight and, but one of the things

that he said to me, look, if you
gain weight, like that's a problem.

And you know, I had been a goal
weight for a long time and he

obviously was attracted to that.

Um, but the minute we got married, he,
he immediately told me that I needed

to get a boob job and that I needed to,
alter, you know, get my hair needed to

be black, my nails to be done certain
way, that I needed to work out my arms.

I needed to be more toned.

And I was like, uh, you know, so
it was a difficult on, know, I saw

some problems on the honeymoon.

We had some issues and I
thought, man, this is what it's

about when people get married.

And then, um, you know, they,
they come home and get an, an alt.

I mean, that's where I was
like, I am, I'm just not.

And I told him he had a dream,
actually, speaking of dreams, he had

a dream once before we got married.

And actually I think it was before we
even got engaged where I was in a fire.

A house and he was a police officer.

And so he had this dream that he was
running into the house yelling at me

to get out of the house to save me.

And I was like, you
don't tell me what to do.

what I said in the dream to him.

And I'm like, well, so do you
not know that that's who I am?

You don't you, you just
don't tell me what to do.

I mean, there's ways to guide me and,
but I'm just one of those rebels.

um, it was, it was difficult that
first couple months of our marriage.

But when he finally moved to Hawaii
and I stayed behind to get everything

ready, I then got to Hawaii in April
and our first dinner, I, he had told

me so many times, you to do a boob job.

I'll pay for it.

I'm like, I'm not putting a
foreign object in my body.

I, I, no, I had worked so hard,
actually, I had reversed every

single medical condition I had
when I had lost all my weight.

And I, and I had done all kinds
of research about that stuff and

um, and he was willing to pay it.

He was like, Hey, you know, I
even met with my doctor and I

said, no, it's not right for me.

So the first day back on the island,
to dinner and I said, just so you

know, I'm not gonna do that and I
don't you ever bring it up again?

And I was just like, I'm not, no.

And I think that was when he first
really, really realized that like.

Something wasn't right.

You know, it, it, he's just
like, I can't control her.

So we went a couple more months.

Um, I ended up landing a TV show
in Hawaii because I knew nobody.

And I went to a networking
event and somebody said, Hey

Becky, you'd be great for tv.

There's a community TV show.

I said, sure, I'd love to do it.

That's gonna force me to get
out in the community and get to

know people and interview them.

And I love that venue, venue.

And sure enough, I did
it well in the process.

Um, part of him working for the Polynesian
Culture Center gave us free education.

he said, why don't you go back
and finish your education?

And I said, well, do you
want me to continue looking

for a job or do you want me

make you know, or go go to school?

'cause we get it free.

And he says, well, I think it's more
important that you get your schooling

done, so to make that your full-time job.

And I was like, okay.

So I, I enrolled, well four months after I
had gotten to the island, um, we had been

in some therapy because things were kind
of going, we were having a difficult time.

I don't see him changing here.

'cause like he's, he's not,
marriage is in trouble.

And I was like, what the ocean?

And he worked at two o'clock
in the afternoon and we.

Just gotten back and he wanted me
to collect all these tax forms and

tax receipts for our tax forms.

he was wanting me to sign
a fraudulent tax return.

And I knew it.

I mean, my dad was an accounting
professor, like I'm not dumb.

And I, I said, that's not legal.

And he's like, well, you, we
need to have you sign it because

it, it needs to be turned in.

And I said, well, I'm sorry I
don't do that kind of stuff.

within 10 minutes, um, he turned to me
and he says, we need to get divorced

and we need to get divorced fast.

And I was

Jethro Jones: Wow.

Becky Sampson: what?

Jethro Jones: After like a year.

Becky Sampson: This was just
after a year of us being

Jethro Jones: Wow.

Becky Sampson: and only four
months on the, on the island.

And so I was like, wow.

And, and I mean, so of course he
goes to work, I make some phone

calls to find out what my rights are.

I'm like, what do I do?

You know, I'm on the island.

I, I don't know hardly anybody.

um, so the next day I sat him down
before he went to work and I, and

we sat on the deck out on the, we,
we lived right on the beach in an

apartment, we were on the deck.

And I said to him, I said, will you please
help me understand, like, what, what is

it that you don't like about me or what?

That you don't what
they have problem with.

And it was funny 'cause as
he started telling me these

things, I said, wait a minute.

Hold on one second.

'cause I document everything.

So I'm like, I need to go get my notepad.

So I went and got my notebook, brought
it back, and I started writing.

And I said, okay, so, so tell
me what you have a problem with.

And so I'd write it down and he,
and, and I'm like, okay, what else?

Like, I didn't respond.

And I know it was the spirit that was
with me that day because what he was

saying was just bouncing off of me.

It wasn't like I wasn't
taking it personally.

I just, I genuinely wanted to know
what in the heck is wrong with me

that you don't wanna be married to me?

And so I'd write it down.

And one of the things that he said,
and he said, the best thing he, he

could have ever said to me, he turned
to me in all seriousness and said,

Becky, having a really hard time seeing
the value that you bring to my life.

Jethro Jones: Wow.

Becky Sampson: And I know the
spirit Then filled my heart and

said to him, here's the good news.

I know the value that I bring to
your life, whether you choose to see

it or not, is none of my business.

Jethro Jones: Uh, and given your
background and story, the things you've

said so far, that seems totally not
characteristic of you to say that,

Becky Sampson: Right, exactly

Jethro Jones: yeah.

That's amazing.

Becky Sampson: God has this amazing way of

preparing

us for what we have, and I know that
that's something that you talk about

is that prepared me for that moment.

He prepared me to go,
Becky, you are a value.

Even though this man not see you as
value, not mean you're not valuable.

You are a value.

Even though this man, obviously he
made all this, I don't trust you.

You're not trustworthy, I'm
like, no, he's not trustworthy, not.

All of these things were projections.

It wasn't.

Now, it doesn't mean that
there's some not there.

There's some truth to some of that,
but that was a defining moment for me.

I. Where I, I finally stood up for
myself and it took another four

months, of me really just like,
are you sure this is what you want?

Because this is the con consequences.

I even put it on a big board.

I said, look, we get a divorce.

This is what's gonna happen.

This is, alimony, even though it was a
short marriage, there's still big board.

I said, look, we get divorced.

And I was like, are you kidding?

Well, stuff that needs to be taken.

He goes, I still want, until I went and
had and, and got all the information

and went and filed for the divorce,
but here's where God is amazing because

in January I was still holding hope.

I'm like, I said to him, I said, why don't
you just stay for one more year, allow

me to graduate and get my schooling done?

I was genuine in asking him to do that.

Just stay one more year so we can do that.

He went off to work that
day and the spirit whispered

to me, go check his email.

And I went and checked the email and
sure enough, he had already bought a

couple days before that he had bought
his plane ticket off the island.

And I decided personally that I would
not bring it up to him because I

wanted to see if he was gonna be a man
enough to tell me when he was leaving.

And um, sure enough, he didn't.

He never did.

And at that point I knew
my marriage was over.

I

Jethro Jones: Wow.

Becky Sampson: he was scheming
stuff on that backend.

um, I went to the courthouse within
that week and started getting my papers.

It took me a couple months to fill 'em
all out, but I went and did a lot of

research, went through all of this stuff.

And in May, in March, so that was
January, in March, sixth to be exact,

I turned my paperwork in because
I knew he was leaving in April,

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: And I
turned the paperwork in.

And if you remember, in
2020, COVID was crazy.

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: and they were
closing all kinds of stuff.

And in Hawaii, they're
a very liberal there.

And, um, and I mean, every day
it was like day by day they were

shutting more and more things down
he was trying to get off the island.

And so I, I knew that I needed the
paperwork back order to serve him.

'cause if he left the island, I
would not be able to serve him.

I don't know where he'd go.

I don't know where he is staying.

'cause we had rented out the
house for a couple of years.

And so I go to the court, turn
it in, don't hear anything.

Two weeks later, a business partner
of mine called me and he said, he

says, Becky, um, you need to go
back to the court and get them to

fill out that paperwork so that
you can serve him before he leaves.

So you need to go back to them
and let them know that you're

leaving and or that he's leaving.

So I go back, I turn the paperwork
in and the lady's like, well,

you need to do an ex parte.

And I was like, what's an ex parte?

I don't know what I'm doing.

Like, and she's like, yeah, you
need to fill out this ex parte,

'cause I was in seven full, it was
like eight o'clock in the morning.

I must not have gone to school that
day, by the way, until I was getting

Jethro Jones: While your
life is falling apart.

Yeah.

Becky Sampson: at 46.

So anyway, I go down, I turn that
stuff into the, and it's an hour and

15 minute drive down to the court.

And I'd usually just turn
around and come back.

But for some reason, all know

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: I stuck around
and I did some shopping.

'cause there's a Costco down
there in a Walmart and everything.

And all of a sudden I get a
call from my business partner.

He calls me at two o'clock in
the afternoon and he says, Becky,

still around the courthouse?

And I

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: that's so
funny that you asked that.

I said, yes, I am.

He says, you need to go back.

And I said, need it for work
so that you can serve him.

I go back to the courthouse,
I'm in the parking lot.

I make a phone call to the clerk's
office 'cause it goes to the self-help

and then goes upstairs to the clerk, to

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: judge.

I talked to her and I said, look, here's
signed and it will be down situation.

And she goes, give me

Jethro Jones: Wow.

Becky Sampson: and I'll
have it the very next day.

Hey, when you work for
God, God works for you.

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Becky Sampson: And um,

Jethro Jones: So let me ask
you a question, if I may.

Why was your business partner getting
this insight and telling you and not you

hearing it yourself and acting on it?

What's your thought on that?

Becky Sampson: I

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: I was doing.

I mean, at that time I,

there, there's a lot more
I could go into that.

Um, however I was, I was compromised.

I, I believe my safety was compromised.

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: um, and so I, I
and I, I didn't have any money.

I had hardly any money to my name.

I didn't know hardly
anybody on the island.

And I, I and I, I didn't have any.

And people were worried about,

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Well, yeah, and the thing that I'll
add to that is God speaks to us, like

we said, and sometimes he needs to
speak through other people, sometimes

through dreams, sometimes through
vision, sometimes through whatever.

But the thing is that God is
always looking out for us.

And so sometimes that is your
business partner saying You,

this is what you need to do.

And, and that is God's method of
communicating with us if we are

open to seeing it, which is what
we were talking about before.

Right.

Becky Sampson: be able to recognize that.

And this is what I've learned about
God over the years, and maybe you have

too, but it is this superpower, like
when you understand that God is trying

to communicate to us all the time,

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: when we recognize when
he does, and then give him credit for

it and say, God, I know that was you.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: that was you.

Even on the most minute thing to the,
to the bigger things like that was, um,

he's like, oh, she's paying attention.

I'm gonna

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Becky Sampson: she's, and, and so it's,
as I tuned my ear, and granted at those

beginning stages, I was in absolute panic.

Like and, and so it was, I finally did
stomach, but as my divorce went on,

I mean that the airport when he flew,
because they were canceling flights

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: And that was also another
God drop because I was able to serve

him before he left instead of serving
him before he stayed on the island.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: I, uh, and one of my
biggest thing is, is the day that I

took him to the airport, he didn't
know I was gonna be serving him.

I drove him down there.

Um, there's a picture of me with tears in
my eyes because I knew how hard this was

gonna be for him and me, and I let him go.

He got served.

but my prayer to heavenly father when
I left that airport was, please God,

keep my heart soft him and towards
all other men that are in my life.

Because I didn't want this
experience to make me bitter.

I wanted to become better.

And that, and I will tell you that
was probably one of the most growth

promoting experiences of my life
because I ended up in court for three

and a half years with him, 21 hearings.

I ended up subpoenaing him 21 times,
multiple, um, felonies that he

Jethro Jones: Hmm.

Becky Sampson: and all while
getting my degree in com

that he had.

Conflict

Jethro Jones: Crazy.

Becky Sampson: and peace building,
we're going to if he was.

But back to what you
talked about, those walks

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Yeah.

Becky Sampson: with God, were
those two hours every morning

when I was ill on the beach.

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: me learning to communicate
with God through that process and

learning to hear him and to be silent
and to, and I always say, you miss a

hundred percent of the sunrises that
you don't get outta bed for because I

lived the, the west side of the island.

So the sun came right up in my window.

'cause I lived right on the beach
and I would spend the first couple

hours in the, in the ocean in the

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: mornings.

that was my god time.

And I had this, this playlist, I call
it the God playlist because it was, it

was like, and I'd put it on rotation.

And so like when I listened to that
song, it was like the perfect song.

And God's like, for some reason it
was always Jesus walking on the ocean.

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: Like, I'm like, and
here I am walking on the ocean,

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: or the beach.

But um, but there were so many times, and
I talked about this on another podcast the

other day, that there's just so many times
where I. Would wake up in the morning

during my divorce, and I knew nothing.

I knew nothing about the
court system when I started.

And God would go, Becky, you
need to put this motion in.

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: I would go, what, what?

What's that?

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: what motion?

And I'd have to go do all this research,
Becky, contact this person, write up this

thing, uh, this memo for the, the judge.

Do this discovery, do this subpoena.

I mean, I didn't know
what the heck I was doing.

And because I partnered with God,
I really felt like, and I, I won

my case up against five attorneys.

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: Um, it was all said
and done, three and a half years, I

did end up with an attorney and he
even took my case and was like, how

in the world, girl did you get all

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: back?

I think I told you about
that the other day.

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: And, um, and it was
because I couldn't afford not to

get the information back and all
I, all I wanted, okay, because some

people at this situation and go,
Becky, all you cared about was money.

I'm like, it was never about the money.

The best thing he could have ever said
is that I didn't have value and for

me to be able to stand up for myself.

In that court case for three
and a half years to be able

to stand and go, I am a value.

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: love what my attorney
said when he first called me.

'cause I was trying to prove,
you know what I did, you know?

And he says, Becky, I don't care
if you sat on the couch eight bomb

bonds and gained a hundred pounds,
you are still entitled to half of the

increase when you've gotten married.

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: And I, and I said to
him, I said, thank you so much not

making me prove my very existence.

Jethro Jones: Yeah, that, that
piece is really, really powerful.

There's the legal part of it, which is,
you're entitled to this because you got

married and, and that's how it goes.

But that means nothing compared
to the spiritual value.

Of you understanding that
you really do have value.

And, and to me that is just that,
that is the God drop, that is

the, the spiritual nature of it.

And you having the openness and
understanding and having the spirit

with you saying you are valuable
at, at a point where everything in

the world was telling you that you
weren't because your spouse was saying,

you're not adding value to my life.

And, and that is, that has got to
be a very difficult thing to go

through, especially when you said,
Hey, I'm not doing this again.

This is, we're committed.

Becky Sampson: I, I was a
hundred percent committed.

And the,

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: is, is that in
that, with and, and my husband now,

I've, I'm married now for the third
time and very happily married,

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: last time

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: but he was in the same
situation I was in with his marriage.

Was is that when somebody, it
takes two to get married, but it

only takes one to get divorced.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: I mean, I, I told
him I would have, I, I did give him

everything that I had, like everything
because that, this was my last one.

And so for me, I I, it was hard for
me when he's like, no, I'm out, like

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: and I, and when I'm
coaching with people and I have

a client that's not coachable,
I, there's nothing I can do.

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: the same
thing happens with God.

God can't do for us what we're
unwilling to allow him to do.

Jethro Jones: Yep.

Becky Sampson: so, but I was so
open and here I was on an island.

I mean, I, one of the books I'd love
to write, or a chapter at least, is

like living in paradise on pennies.

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: I, I still cannot
explain I stayed there for

five years with no real income.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: And
somehow God made it work.

And it was like, but the interesting
thing is, is that it got to the point

where I was divorced in October 22.

That's October.

It got to the point where I

And everybody knew how

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: hard I had fought for this.

I just want a fair and equitable division.

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: I wanted.

And I think he was terrified that I
was gonna take him for everything.

And I'm like, I never had that intention.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: That
was never my come from.

what he, you know, that's his
story and all of that stuff.

I just wonder what was fair and equitable.

And finally there was a finality to that.

And all this time during the divorce,
I had applied for 45 different

jobs and I, nobody hired me.

I could not get hired.

I did start a couple podcasts
and got paid $10 an hour to

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: for BYU Hawaii.

'cause I was a student.

I was like,

Jethro Jones: Yeah,

Becky Sampson: me?

Jethro Jones: yeah.

Becky Sampson: $10 to $12.

And thing I could show the court
about getting hired is because God

has somewhere else for you to be.

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: And I was like,
no, I wanna, I didn't ever

think I'd get married again.

I'm like, Nope.

I, I'm, I love Hawaii.

I love the people.

I, I, I had felt so much
healing and serenity there.

The ocean was what healed me every day.

my little mermaid group that I
swam with every day and community.

And she's, and, and so when that money
hit the bank account, something happened

in me and I finally became willing.

I

Jethro Jones: Hmm.

Becky Sampson: God, my prayer to him was,
please, if it's not here in Hawaii, send

me somewhere that I, you can use my skills
and abilities to bless people's lives.

And five days later, I'm laying in bed
on a Sunday morning and my, my landlord

had told me that I needed to move.

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: they, they're friends
of mine, they were friends of mine,

but they're like, you know what,
we've gotta, and they didn't even

know that I got this final finalized.

Um, and I was, all of a sudden I looked
over and I got this impression to look

on my phone and to get on this dating app
that I hardly ever get on, which I swore

I'd never do again because I, I worked for
a dating site doing all their podcasts.

And anyway, I happened to look over and
I saw this one man from Sigar, Utah.

was like, cigar, like I know
where cigarette is because

that's down by our summer camp.

Jethro Jones: But nobody else does.

Becky Sampson: Nobody else
knows where cigarette is.

And so I swiped on him and he swiped back
or, or something, and immediately like we

got connected I said, oh my gosh, I know
where cigarette is like and everything.

I said, gimme your cell phone
number because your cell phone,

I need to send you a picture.

And so I, he sent me a cell phone number.

I sent him a picture and he
says, stop right there, Becky.

He's like, I know exactly
where your property is.

I have driven by that
place my entire life.

I said, well, guess what?

I've been through
cigarette my entire life.

We jump on a call on the way down.

I was driving down that Sunday afternoon
after church to meet with missionaries

'cause I was still trying to find a job.

And um, and on the way down there,
I talked to him for the whole hour.

And all he talked about was his ex-wife.

He'd only been divorced for six weeks
after 27 and a half year marriage.

And uh, and one of the things
he asked me, actually, I don't

know if he's, he'll be okay.

of the things he asked me is he
says, he says, Becky, do you think

I'm, do, do you think I'm cute?

I'm like, are you kidding me?

You, you're so ants.

I'm like, that's really a strange
question to ask somebody you just met.

Um, but apparently he never got told that.

and um, so all I remember about
that first conversation was that he.

That he was, I I, and I've dated and
coached enough people to realize, look,

you know, if all you can talk about
is your ex, you're not ready to date.

And um, of blew him off.

I was like, well, have a nice,
it's nice to meet you and yes,

that's great and whatever.

But then he called me the next
day and every day from that

point on for exactly 30 days, we
talked at least six hours a day.

Jethro Jones: Wow.

Becky Sampson: And I flew
home on Christmas day.

He went and met my mom before he met me.

'cause my mom was picking
me up at the airport.

I said, why don't you
just go to my mom's house?

You can meet my mom, you
can come to the airport.

So he always tells me and reminds me
that I met your mom before I met you.

And, uh, needless to say, we got
married a few months later after that,

we, we knew it was the right thing.

And he is the best thing
that's ever happened to me.

And my point in telling that story is, is
that we don't know, I don't know if you've

ever seen that visual where Christ is
holding this teddy bear behind his back.

Have you ever seen that one

Jethro Jones: Yep.

Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: where he is got this
huge teddy bear behind your back

and this little girl's got this
little tiny teddy bear going, no,

Christ, I don't wanna give it to you.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: my teddy bear.

Huge teddy bear behind your back.

And this little girl's got the Lord has.

And, and, and we have
no idea what I'm here.

And, and we have no idea what
a marriage that, that I'm in.

I.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: I want and needed that
kind of commitment to know, because I

love marriage, I love men, and I wasn't
given that opportunity in my second

marriage to really even do anything.

So I had to do what I had to
do to take care of myself.

Um, but you know, to go way back to
your question of what brought me here,

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: um, is it's funny
because now we've been married just

over a year and, um, his wife left
him with 21 cents in the bank account

Jethro Jones: Hmm.

Becky Sampson: and after everything
that he's done, and he's a

really, really good man, and he
saw, so let me, let me back up.

Two weeks after I got here, um, after
Christmas, my husband ended up in

court fighting for his granddaughter,
um, because his son, who has had

years, his whole, well, many years
of drug abuse, wanted his daughter

back who he's never taken care of.

On a full-time basis.

And my husband has raised her.

I said, you're gonna have to take
her to take him to court to keep her.

And he's like, I don't wanna do that.

And here, I'd just gotten outta
this three and a half year battle.

And now I'm like, oh God, is
this why you sent me here?

And my husband's like, absolutely.

Where did you come from?

And he didn't fight at
all with his divorce.

And that I, I was feeling a little
resentful at at first because

I was like, look, I just fought
like crazy for what was right.

he's like, but Becky, I
would've never met you.

And the app, he, because he had
so many women after him, he, he

put it to only two hour radius.

So he should not have seen me in Hawaii.

God drops,

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: and then all
of a sudden I get here and two

weeks later we're in court.

And I know about the court system.

I may not know about the children's
part of it, but I knew so much

about the court system and I was
able to support him through that.

And we did, we, we fought for a year.

We lost her.

Um, um, I shouldn't say we lose her
because everything happens for a reason.

Jethro Jones: Exactly.

I mean, that's, that's the whole point.

So you, you did not win
that court situation.

But if we see that it is for our
good, then we can be okay with it.

And we can say, you know, there's,
there's this BYU devotional that was

given by, uh, something Sister Holmes,

Becky Sampson: Mm-hmm.

Jethro Jones: she talks about the ideal,
uh, which is what we want in a situation.

In this situation, you want to
win the court battle and keep the

granddaughter, and then there's the
reality, which is that you did not,

Becky Sampson: Right?

Jethro Jones: and even in her talk,
the problem is not the, the reality.

It never is the problem.

The problem is that we have this ideal
that we think this is the right thing, but

we don't understand God and how he works.

And so we, we are fighting for something
and moving towards something and doing

something, but God has a bigger plan
that includes this thing not happening

the way we mortally are expecting it to.

And we have to be okay with that
because we have to understand that

God is, is wise and knows what he's
doing and isn't going to make things

happen that aren't for our good even,
even if they feel bad in the moment.

Right.

Becky Sampson: and it's just like
if you wanna build muscle in the

gym, you have to break the muscle.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: has to be
broken with resistance, which

is all of our ch conflict and

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: and trials and everything
in order for it to grow back stronger.

And God knows this principle
and we for some reason, fight it

Jethro Jones: All the time.

Becky Sampson: all the

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: so, and I remember
even going through my divorce, I said

to my mom, I said, there is, I feel
like there's a much bigger reason why

I'm going through this divorce and
representing myself and learning all

this stuff about the court system.

I don't know what it is, but I do know
I'm the type of person, even when I lost

my weight, I'm the type of person that I
always want to reach out and help people.

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: people who have lost
150 pounds and don't wanna help.

I expressed that to you the other

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: when we were talking.

And I, I don't, I can't relate to that.

However, that's their choice.

They, that's their own agency
that they, they can do that.

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: For me, I've
always felt like every single

thing that I am experiencing
and sometimes to my detriment.

'cause I'm okay, what are
the steps that I'm doing?

You know what I mean?

Like, I, I need to just be
present in my own struggle and,

and then I can later dissect it
and go, okay, this is what I did.

Because sometimes I'm thinking, oh, I'm
doing this for other people, you know?

And, and I do get caught away.

But what's interesting is I, when I
met my husband now, I told him, I said,

look, I'm just letting you know, I'm
writing a book called Divorcing Strong.

I help people to divorce.

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: you to
do anything to divorce.

Like, like that's crazy.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: now, almost a year later,
um, in January of this year, right, is

when he said to me, when he saw how,
how I light up in helping people through

these processes and through divorce and
through subpoenas, he's like, you need

to start a company called, you know,
that, that, that just says subpoenas.

Because people that usually
get subpoenas are usually the

ones that are disadvantaged.

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: And he's like,
and so the more we thought about

it, and he really pushed me.

We were coming back from St. George
on a two hour drive and he's, he just

kept saying it, kept saying, it kept,
I'm like, are you kidding me, honey?

Like are really like, he's like, Becky.

You are too good at this
to, to not help people.

And then he started seeing
how I was helping people

through divorce, coaching them.

And, and I said, really what
I'm at is I'm a strategist.

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: then I
started thinking about it.

I'm like, okay, I'll, if I do a subpoena
thing, I could do it for attorneys.

I can't do it for pro se people
because I don't have a license.

And I was gonna call it Aloha Legal.

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: And then I
was gonna call it Apex Legal.

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: that doesn't
tell you what to do.

I'm like, all I do is only subpoenas.

So now my company is called only
subpoenas.com and where, where I help

people divorce, uncover the hidden
assets, but I also help other attorneys.

We learn through our process with
this last attorney that we had.

Typically don't like to do subpoenas
because they require some more detailed

process and they don't like to do it.

I love to do it.

And

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: Of course I've got
the nickname Becky Brockovich now,

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

That's awesome.

Becky Sampson: So yeah.

So now this business has been born
out of the struggles that we've had.

And, and it's interesting because
some people though, I have a

paralegal or I have a team and, our
attorney that was fighting for this

granddaughter, we needed to subpoena
some, some records, some bank records.

And he's like, I don't wanna do it.

And my husband's like, well, I'm,
I'm sorry, but we need to do it.

I wanna do this.

And he's like, well, fine,
I'll charge you $500.

And I was thinking $500 for what?

What would you do that for?

And he just, and he was trying to
just discourage us from doing it,

but we knew that this is how, one
way that we were gonna win the

case or at least get leverage.

And so he says, fine, I'll do it for $500.

Well, his assistant or his paralegal,
we get off the phone, go and do my due

diligence on that subpoena like I always
do, and came back to her 45 minutes.

And that paralegal was like, oh, no,
no, Becky, I've already sent it off

to the bank and it's been rejected.

And I'm like, well, did you
do this, this, this, and this?

And she goes, how do you know?

Well, it's 'cause this is what I do, and
so I sent her the information on it and

she sent it and it went right through.

So my point is, is that even if people
have paralegals, they, got so much on

their plate and attorneys have so much
on their plate, but subpoenas win cases.

And in that point, when my husband
saw that happen, he's like,

you need to do this business.

And

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Well, and there's another lesson
here that I think most people would

gloss over, which is that you.

It.

Anytime you're hiring someone to do
something for you, you still have to

be aware and involved in that thing.

Like you can't just take expertise
for granted because they're, they may

say they're fighting for you, but the
reality is, is they don't care about

you as much as you care about you

Becky Sampson: Because

Jethro Jones: and go ahead.

Becky Sampson: that,
that applies to doctors,

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: that applies
to the educational system,

Jethro Jones: Yep.

Becky Sampson: that
applies to, uh, lawyers.

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: um, I I'm gonna
write an article called, don't I?

I, um, I can, I'm gonna write an article
called Most, I mean, first of all,

Jethro Jones: I like it.

Becky Sampson: are very, very, Mary,
the first divorce attorney you meet.

She didn't have an attorney yet.

She hadn't been served yet.

so I went through just the basic stuff.

You know, I'm not a lawyer, so I can't
give legal advice, but I just explain

them and educate them about the process.

then I circled back around to her and
she goes, oh, Becky, it's great this,

you know, I finally got an attorney and
she's best friends with my soon to be

former husband's attorney and they're
gonna be able to work everything out.

And she said that, she told me that
I have to choose between alimony and

between half of our business that we own.

And I'm like, sweetheart,
I'm not an attorney.

I can't give you attorney advice.

give you legal advice, but you
might wanna go to this certain code.

he, I directed her to certain the code.

I said, those are dealt with very
differently in the court system.

So you're not entitled to just one,
you're entitled to both legally, and your

attorneys doesn't have your best interest.

sound to me at least.

And so, and I said, I don't know.

You need to do your own research and you
might wanna take this, you might wanna

consider taking this to your attorney.

Be, and, and that just proved to me
that even if you have an attorney, you

still need to advocate for yourself.

We advocated with, for ourselves
attorneys, we hire, they

don't hire us, we hire them.

And, um, now they, they are experts.

They've, they've been through
a lot more than we do.

They understand the law a lot more, but.

But that also, well, the other thought
that just came to me too is advocate

for yourself and your own marriage too.

Um, that is challenged.

Like I, I had to advocate for myself
and, and say, look, I know my value.

but that is something that I, I now am
so passionate this podcast I did last

Friday, we talked a lot about how the men
don't have support going through divorce.

And people have asked me to
do support groups for men.

I truly believe men need to support men.

Um, I do think I do have value.

I can bring to the table for them
because I do believe that he does not

allow them a free and safe space to,
to like something that I, when I

was left with very little money on the
island and I, I can't even tell you how

many times I woke up in absolute panic.

Yes.

Could I have gone back to Utah?

I didn't feel like that's
what God wanted me to do.

I. I don't feel like it was safe.

I was resisting it.

And it's interesting that once that
finalized and I finally got willing to

go, okay, God, like, where do you need me?

I'm totally open to, to and your will.

He like closed that door

like that and said, move.

Jethro Jones: Well, and, and what's
really amazing is that he, he

could have taken care of you and
had you move to Utah beforehand.

Right.

And, and we know that he is all powerful.

So we believe that he,
that he could do that.

But like we've been talking about the
whole time, we also have to be willing.

And so we, we have to put our trust in
him and say, all right, I'm ready now.

And that's such a key point that.

Uh, he, he loves us and he is the one
who's gonna go to bat for us all the time.

Any earthly person is not
despite their best intentions.

And I even say this about our, our
own parents and us towards our kids.

No, I care about my kids more than
I can even describe, and I am not

going to care about them, about their
life as much as they personally are.

I don't have that capacity yet, but I'm
about as close as I can get to having that

capacity, and, and I still don't have it.

And, and we put so much trust and faith
in the institutions and systems and, and,

uh, position and bishops and positions.

And the reality is, is that not
a single one of them loves us,

like our heavenly father does.

And, and we can work with them and
we can like enter into agreements

with them and all that kind of stuff,
but they will never, and they, it is

impossible for them to have that kind
of insight and love into our life.

And, and once I personally realized that,
then that made a huge difference for me.

That somebody can recommend something
and I can say, yes, you're smart.

Yes, you've got experience.

Yes, you've got education,
but this is also my life.

And you, you cannot possibly
care about this as much as I do.

And, and so that.

That's still an idea that I'm trying
to understand fully, but I know

there's an inkling of truth there that

Becky Sampson: Mm-hmm.

Jethro Jones: that means something
that is bigger than what I can

articulate right this moment.

Becky Sampson: Well,
and, and, and I, yeah.

You actually are making me think of
several different times in my life where

I've had to advocate for myself and even
coming outta my first divorce when there

was violence involved and I was having
to get a protective order, um, I remember

calling our bishop, and our bishop
is a beautiful, he's a wonderful man.

Okay.

Imperfect.

Wonderful.

And I called him and I told him,
I said, I'm, I'm, about getting

a protective order because of
certain things that were happening.

And he said to me, he says,
Becky, you're overreacting.

I said, I do, I do not need your
permission to take care of myself.

And it was only a couple weeks later
where we had an incident that happened

at his house, um, at 10 o'clock at night.

He was in his pajamas that my husband,
my husband at the time, and I were

there and my husband got violent and
he saw what, firsthand what happened.

And he called me the next day and he says,
if you were my daughter, I, I'm so sorry.

You know?

So yeah, we do, we, and there's no
way even a court system, and this

is what I tell people going into the
court system, no judge, I mean, you've

got maybe 15 minutes max to maybe
30 minutes to get your story out.

If even that, and you're expecting
them to know all the details.

Like you, you have to, it's, speak
up for ourself and God, like what I've

learned is that God will sends me bumpers.

Okay.

I remember many years ago I was doing a
podcast and I was gonna interview, I was

referred to somebody to interview and
these guys wanted to hire me to be one of

their co-hosts and they, they used to do
like news every day and all that stuff.

And somebody sent me a
message, a private message.

'cause I used to show pictures of
everybody I met all over Facebook.

And, um, so I posted something and
somebody just sent me a private

message and just said, Hey Becky,
you might wanna consider not

And I always appreciate that,
that somebody doesn't come and

gossip about anything, that they
just kind of give me bumpers.

And I have felt like God has
done that my entire life.

circling back to my dad, I feel
like God allowed me, my dad to be

close to me during that time, that
three and a half years that I, or

five years that I was in Hawaii.

there were so many times that I was
standing on the beach where I could just

hear my dad going, I'm so proud of you.

I'm so proud of who you are, who you've
become, who you've, you haven't allowed

your heart to be hardened the world.

'cause remember that last letter he wrote
me don't let people harden you and, and

make you into somebody that you're not.

I just remembered that in this moment.

I didn't make that connection,

but

'cause I, I do believe that
one of the things in this life,

when we get to the other side.

There was a talk many years ago, and I
think it was DER Holland if I remember

correctly, that said, when we get on the
other side, there's gonna be one question

that we're asked, did you learn to love?

Did you learn to love yourself?

Did you learn to love others?

Did you learn to love your enemies?

Because really at the end of
the day, that's pure charity.

Can you love people despite
what they do to you?

Despite what they say?

Despite, and that was probably
the greatest gift that my former

husband gave me during that journey.

'cause I fought like, I was
still on the day that we settled.

still went into that courtroom
seeing him as God sees him, I still

was saying in my heart, I love you.

I care about you.

I know you're terrified.

I couldn't change that for him, but
I could change who I was through

that and, and that is my greatest
accomplishment in all of that.

It has nothing to do with the
money, it has nothing to do with,

but I had to learn to rely on God
during that process, not only in

the legal system, but my financials.

And I had to learn to listen and
take direction from him, and I'm

finding exactly the same things
happening now, building this business.

It's like I wake up and he's
like, you need to connect with

this person and get on that.

Like it's a total fluke
that you and I met.

I mean, not a total fluke,
you know what I'm saying?

Jethro Jones: Definitely something
that God orchestrated and inspired

and, and made to be the case.

And, and here's what's really
interesting is I, so I, this is the

first year that I'm doing this podcast,
so I have to find all the 12 people.

And, um, and at the beginning
of this month, I, I didn't have

the next two months ready to go.

And so I was feeling like some pressure.

But when, here's the thing, when, when God
put this into my heart and said, you need

to do this podcast, I knew that I had to
find people who'd be committed and willing

to do this for the next decade, who
would be willing to talk with me every.

Every, uh, year for that next decade and
build this relationship and be willing

to come back and, and do it again.

And so I've been trying really
hard to listen when God says

this is who, who should be on it.

And I don't understand why that is.

And I imagine at least one person
is going to back out and say,

I'm not gonna do this anymore.

And, and I'm, I'm okay with that
because it is like, this is not,

this is not Jethro's glory here.

This is me just trying
to listen to the spirit.

And, and so I'm sure that that is going to
happen, that somebody's going to back out.

And if they do then that's fine.

But I've been trying really hard to
listen and, and then invite people

when the spirit directs me to.

And you, last week when we were
talking, that was the exact situation.

And like, I hadn't even thought
about it when, when it happened and

we were in a group together, you
mentioned something and it connected

me with somebody else that I had
interviewed on a totally different

podcast about totally different things.

And I said, I need to just do this
and, and share this person with you.

And then, uh, you called me afterward.

We had texted back and forth a
little bit, and then you called me

and I was like, as we were talking.

I just was like, we need, she needs to
be on a decade, never to be forgotten.

And, and like it was just clear as day.

And I was like, man, we're talking
about very different things and

then I'm gonna bring this in.

Like, is that, like,
how's she gonna respond?

And then here's the crazy thing, uh, and
this was a testimony to me that, that

the Lord is involved is you texted me
this morning and said, Hey, are you LDS?

And you had forgotten how we
had connected, which is totally,

Becky Sampson: Yeah.

Jethro Jones: is totally understandable.

And we had spoken only very briefly,
but it was like, it, you still were

willing to do it and still were like
on board with it and everything.

And, and what's so cool is that
we don't have to see the end

from the beginning because we
just need to take that next step.

And the next step for me last week was
to say, Hey, are you willing to do this?

And you said Yes.

And, and so now, uh, here we are and
this has been an amazing conversation

and I'm so grateful for it because
I've had so many questions that I have

answered in our conversation, and there's
no reason why that should be the case.

And I'm sure somebody listening
is gonna have the same experience.

Becky Sampson: really one of those,
I mean, when you really start paying

attention, like really, really, like
when I, I'm gonna speak for myself.

When I really started paying
attention to these God drops in my

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: and these connections,
because I, I actually, the only

reason why I was on that meeting last
week where I met you was because I

reached out to that one sister that
told me, Becky, do you think maybe

God has somewhere else for you to be,

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: works for the
LDS employment in Hawaii.

And I called her last week and I was
like, Hey, I need someone that knows

about this certain thing in business.

And she sent me to this, sent me to,
you know, the lady that did the meeting.

And then we got on.

And then, and this is the one thing
that I've learned too, is God,

God cannot drive a parked car.

Okay.

Like I've learned that I have to be in
motion, meaning take my foot off the,

off the brake, which is all my fears
and all my doubts and all my everything.

get in the car and start
driving in a certain direction.

And then he directs me,
oh, call this person.

Oh, do this, oh, connect here.

I am an action taker.

So I, 'cause, 'cause inspiration
will come and then it will leave.

It will literally leave just as quickly
as it comes if you don't take action.

And, um, and it may come back again,
But I, I've learned that I did not

know when I started the process
of the divorce that I would end

up married to the love of my life.

I had no idea what that journey and,
and now, and I said to my husband last

night, I said, I love who I've become.

And one of your questions to
consider was like, who are you

gonna become the next 10 years?

Like I'm sitting here, just, one of my
other quotes that says that life is just.

De have detached observation.

Just don't take, take the shame and
the, the guilt and just detach from it.

Like you're watching a movie and
going, wow, that's interesting.

That journey and that journey.

And that's connecting here.

And that's connecting here.

And I may, and I said yesterday
in another podcast that I was

like, I meet people sometimes and
I have no idea why we're meeting.

They're like, why are we meeting?

I'm like, I dunno.

just got this impression that
I'm like, like I just made a

connection to someone yesterday.

And she's like, but I don't want this.

I'm like, no.

I just, I don't know.

I heard you speak and I,
I wanna connect with you.

And, and you never know where
any of those things are gonna go.

And you don't know if 10 years down
the road you're gonna go, Hey, you

know what, Jetro, there's, there's
something I, I wanna connect you to.

You just knows.

why are we trying to do this on our own?

Like, why do I try to do it on my own?

I should speak for myself.

So

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: finally let go is
when things happen and God works

in, he works so fast sometimes.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Well, as I've been going through my
own struggles in the last, year or

so, what I have talked about with
my wife numerous times is in a two

week period, our lives can totally
change for the better or the worse.

And God has the power to put us in
a totally different position than

we even thought was possible, in
a short span of just two weeks.

And so as we're struggling through
things, as we're waiting for God's

will to come to pass for us to be able
to understand what he's doing, that

will change probably very quickly.

Like you have already shared in this,
that, you know, one day you get the

income in your, the money in your
bank, and then the next day you're

talking for the first hour with

Becky Sampson: I met my new husband.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: what?

Jethro Jones: it just happens like
life changes very quickly and God

has the power to make that happen.

And so when we are frustrated and
bummed that the things that we want

are not happening the way that we
think they should, we really need to

take a step back and like you said,
being a detached observer and just say,

alright, where is God's hand in this?

What is he doing in my life
right now so that I can have

the life that he, eternal life.

Yeah.

Becky Sampson: step?

Jethro Jones: Where do I go next?

What do I need to be doing?

And, you know, I don't have all the
answers for my life and none of us

do, but we feel like we want to.

And where I shared that talk by
Sister Holmes about the ideal.

That's what the problem is.

We think the ideal is what we want.

We think that our ideal is what we
want, and God's like, no, what you need.

And what you should want is
the plan that I have for you.

And be open to that.

And when you're open to that, then
you see the miracles, you see the

amazing things that are happening.

And sure, we're going to have
disappointment, but if we can take a

take a minute and go back and say, wait
a minute, where do I want to really be?

What do I really want God
to be doing in my life?

When we do that, then we are going
to have amazing opportunities

that we weren't even prepared for.

And I'm saying this myself because I need
to hear it for crying out loud because

Becky Sampson: the credit.

Jethro Jones: Yes,

Becky Sampson: God the credit.

Jethro Jones: because it is his
plan and he is the one who's,

who's making things happen.

And, and even if things are hard right
now, he knows that it's worthwhile.

And at some point we
will understand that too.

Becky Sampson: Mm-hmm.

Jethro Jones: it may not even be
in this life, and that's okay too.

But we're gonna see the,
the beauty in his work.

Becky Sampson: Well, the other thing
too that I, I, from years of struggling

financially, um, I, I learned this
principle that when that anxiety that

I felt even through the troubles and
the trials and tribulations, temporary.

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: It, it, Satan is going
to convince you that it's permanent.

It's a permanent state of
dis, you know, overwhelm or

permanent state of discontent.

However, yes, there is a time to grieve.

Yes, there is a time to, to be in like, I
don't know, mode and walk, walk by faith.

But you know, it is that 11th
hour I think they talk about.

It's funny, I always say, I always
say to God, look, I can't, can't

hang on to a piece of dental floss
off the side of a, a freaking cliff.

And he's like, oh no, I got you girl.

I'm like, but it was always on the 11th
hour and the 59th second that he would

like, like, how did that payment come?

I mean, how did, and but
that's how we're tested.

That again, it's the muscle, right?

You gotta have the resistance, you
gotta have the, the, you've gotta

walk by faith in order for God
to, to get us to, to trust him.

And if we were always given what we
were given, then there's no level

of, there's no level of trust.

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: there's it.

So it is all on purpose and
it's not a permanent state.

And I would just breathe through it.

I'm like, well, tomorrow's a brand
new day, you know, or to the next

hour's, a new day for today only.

I'm gonna grieve, you know.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Well, and to your point about always
in the 11th hour or the 59th minute,

the reality is, is that once that that
relief or salvation comes, then it,

it can only come in the 11th hour.

Right.

Because otherwise we
wouldn't even notice it.

We wouldn't even care about it.

You know, it's, it's like that old saying,
I found this in the last place I looked.

Well, of course you did, because why
would you keep looking if you found it?

You wouldn't.

Right.

And so if you find it in the first place,
you look, that is also the last place.

If you find it in the
third place, you look.

That's also the last place.

And the thing is, when we're, when we're
going through these trials, the Lord

delivers us in the last moment because
it'll always be the last moment because

Becky Sampson: point.

Jethro Jones: that's
when the trial's over.

And that's okay.

But it feels like in the moment,
like this has been going on

forever and it will go on forever.

And then the relief comes and I
think the point I'm trying to make

is that if you start out saying.

Okay.

This is a trial.

I'm in the middle of it.

Where's the Lord's hand, and
how am I overcoming this?

Then you don't have to wait
for the deliverance in the 11th

hour, you can experience the
deliverance in the trial itself.

That's an idea that I'm just starting to
grasp that I don't totally understand,

Becky Sampson: that's being

Jethro Jones: there's there.

Becky Sampson: That's having
gratitude during the trial and

gratitude for, for the moment.

Again, the more that you have the
perspective that is happening for you,

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: a journey.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: It's, it's, it
is, it is literally how am I

gonna grow through this and, and
become a better person through it?

And I, you know, I don't have any regrets.

I don't know about you, but I look
back on my life and I mean, even my

husband and I say this now you know,
would've been great if I met him

when I was young and had these kids.

But I said, I wouldn't have
been the same person like you.

It would, I, I am so appreciative
of him now because of

everything I've been through.

I appreciate him more because
of all the men that I dated.

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: said, appreciation is
probably one of the biggest things that

they are lacking in their relationships.

I'm kinder to him because of
what I did to my first husband.

You know, I, I am fighting like crazy
for the relationship because I didn't

get the opportunity to do that the second

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: You know what I mean?

So all of this happens.

Um, you know, if we can look at that
and say, God knows I, I love what

one of my girlfriends would call
when I was going through the divorce.

She goes, Becky, God
knows what God's doing.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: And I was like,

and then one of my girlfriends like, but
then you're gonna look back on this and,

and someday be able to say that this was
the best thing that ever happened to you.

And I'm like,

Jethro Jones: Yeah,

Becky Sampson: I'm I, but I look
back now and go, oh my gosh.

And it doesn't mean that
my life is perfect now.

Jethro Jones: yeah,

Becky Sampson: so beautiful about what
you're doing is every year that you

and I get back together, I'm gonna
be able to go, oh, look at this.

Jethro Jones: yeah.

Yep.

Becky Sampson: journey I've been on.

But having the right perspective.

And that's where, that's where
President Nelson has said to us

is, is that, um, is that, you know,
having the eternal, um, what is it?

The eternal

Jethro Jones: The celestial.

Think celestial.

Becky Sampson: yeah.

Think, think celestial.

That is exactly, if you can think
celestial and pull the perspective away to

be able to see the blessing and the gift,

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: then you
truly can be present

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: in that moment.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Well, I, I think that is a
great place for us to end.

This has been so inspiring.

Thank you so much for your time
and for your life and sharing

so much of your story with us.

Becky Sampson: Gosh, and thank
you, thank you for creating the

space for me to be vulnerable.

I mean, I don't, I don't
cry a lot about my dad.

However, I, and it's okay for me to cry.

I am not embarrassed or anything.

I, it's a beautiful experience.

Um, but I, I thank you for
listening to your own impression

that God's put onto your heart do
this because you'll see blessings.

You know, God knows what God's doing.

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: see blessings in your life.

You're gonna bless other people's lives.

And that's really the whole purpose
why we're here, is to serve one another

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Becky Sampson: to help uplift and
being, bring people to Christ.

That's the whole purpose.

Jethro Jones: Yep.

Becky Sampson: no matter what religion
they are that listens to this or,

but that, um, God loves them

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Becky Sampson: and Christ did
what he did for all of us.

Jethro Jones: Yep.

Becky Sampson: So thank you

Jethro Jones: Thank you.

And thank you everybody who's listening.

We will catch up with
Becky again in a year.

It's gonna be awesome.

Becky Sampson: until next year.